Debate

[Fire Ball]

97% of you can go to hell , don't buy my CD, don't buy tickets ... stay away from me .
You come to a meet and greet I will have you removed from the room and the building with your money back !!

Adje , how dare you assume I agree with him 100% one of My best friend is Eric Vetro he is gay , I am going to be his best man.
I believe He has the right idea for HC ( state Level) where it works in Mass. , standing up to China ... Did you know Putin fired 4 cruse missiles that could carry war heads. 3 days before the last debate . Obama is spineless and I voted for him in 08. Missed 109 Security meetings but got in 109 rounds of Golf. I want to be president so I can have so much time off. I voted for Gay marriage, Marched in Gay rights march's in NYC and in LA , Support Glad. If obama is elected by 2016 the world will be ,shoot first and ask questions later. They laughed at me when I said Putin was our major problem. He ships weapons to 4 countries who in turn ship them out again. I have been a an Lib independent forever. Go stuff it !!

97% of you stay at least 100 ft away from me , I don't want your support !!

[Adje]

Adje , how dare you assume I agree with him 100% one of My best friend is Eric Vetro he is gay , I am going to be his best man.
I believe He has the right idea for HC ( state Level) where it works in Mass. , standing up to China ... Did you know Putin fired 4 cruse missiles that could carry war heads. 3 days before the last debate . Obama is spineless and I voted for him in 08. Missed 109 Security meetings but got in 109 rounds of Golf. I want to be president so I can have so much time off. I voted for Gay marriage, Marched in Gay rights march's in NYC and in LA , Support Glad. If obama is elected by 2016 the world will be ,shoot first and ask questions later. They laughed at me when I said Putin was our major problem. He ships weapons to 4 countries who in turn ship them out again. I have been a an Lib independent forever. Go stuff it !!

97% of you stay at least 100 ft away from me , I don't want your support !!

Wow, there is a lot of paranoia in your post. As if I'm watching Fox News. Let that be said first. Really, you think that an election of any US President would have these results? That says a lot...

As for the gay statement (and not just that) my answer is simple. I think my letter is clear too. You say one thing but your actions clearly state the other

-Did you endorse the candidate that is oposed to gay marriage (and thus equal rights?) YES
-Did you endorse the candidate that isn't pro equal women rights (such as equal pay)? YES
- Did you endorse the candidate that is against Pro-Choice? YES

If Obama can do to the World what you claim above, then Romney will turn the clock on the US by a century. That is what you endorsed. So don't blame me for pointing that out.

@ the mods, Sorry, I know this is off topic but I think I am free to respond to the direct post from Fire Ball to me

[evil nickname]

97% of you can go to hell

Ain't we a little ray of sunshine.

[Fire Ball]

Stop telling me what I believe and what I stand for you bigot : prejudiced, biased, partial, one-sided, sectarian, discriminatory; opinionated, dogmatic, intolerant, narrow-minded, blinkered, illiberal; racist, sexist, chauvinistic, jingoistic; warped, twisted, distorted. Romney is the only that can save the economic world. paranoia: persecution complex, delusions, obsession, psychosis. Look in the mirror Jerk !! I'm done with you and 97% of these jerks that are on this site. You have know idea what you are talking about . I
see dumb people !!


Wow, there is a lot of paranoia in your post. As if I'm watching Fox News. Let that be said first. Really, you think that an election of any US President would have these results? That says a lot...

As for the gay statement (and not just that) my answer is simple. I think my letter is clear too. You say one thing but your actions clearly state the other

-Did you endorse the candidate that is oposed to gay marriage (and thus equal rights?) YES
-Did you endorse the candidate that isn't pro equal women rights (just as equal pay)? YES
- Did you endorse the candidate that is against Pro-Choice? YES

If Obama can do to the World what you claim above, then Romney will turn the clock on the US by a century. That is what you endorsed. So don't blame me for pointing that out.

@ the mods, Sorry, I know this is off topic but I think I am free to respond to the direct post from Fire Ball to me

[Fire Ball]

You are always a little ray of sunshine !! go away and put head back up your ass.

Ain't we a little ray of sunshine.

[allrevvedup]

Hey meat,

I guess I'll be one of the 97% to not go to a show or a meet and greet or buy an album again.

My one meet and greet I went to you responded to me with 'f*** you that's not a question' when I started to talk to you about 'somebody loves me'

I took it as banter and a joke then but after reading what you've had to rant about today then I can safely say I wouldn't want to pay another £200 to do it again.

To me your best work of recent times was hang cool teddy bear and that's what I'd like to remember you for.

But because of this, and the fact that you seem to want to crap all over your fans who shell out crazy amounts of money to see you in all corners of the globe, I just want to say goodbye.

I'm done, no more moderation or posts

[TheDoode]

Stop telling me what I believe and what I stand for you bigot : prejudiced, biased, partial, one-sided, sectarian, discriminatory; opinionated, dogmatic, intolerant, narrow-minded, blinkered, illiberal; racist, sexist, chauvinistic, jingoistic; warped, twisted, distorted. Romney is the only that can save the economic world. paranoia: persecution complex, delusions, obsession, psychosis. Look in the mirror Jerk !! I'm done with you and 97% of these jerks that are on this site. You have know idea what you are talking about . I
see dumb people !!

I think 97% of the people on this site just really really really want you to do well, and be received well in the media, and it's confused them that you've publicly backed a presidential candidate who opposes a lot of your own beliefs.

[Fire Ball]

All of you seem to have it wrong , you hate me , you hurt me , you have nothing to add about anything I do but negative comments . So good get out !!
Good, all revvedup left the building !!!
Don't let the door hit you in the ass !!
Hey meat,

I guess I'll be one of the 97% to not go to a show or a meet and greet or buy an album again.

My one meet and greet I went to you responded to me with 'f*** you that's not a question' when I started to talk to you about 'somebody loves me'

I took it as banter and a joke then but after reading what you've had to rant about today then I can safely say I wouldn't want to pay another £200 to do it again.

To me your best work of recent times was hang cool teddy bear and that's what I'd like to remember you for.

But because of this, and the fact that you seem to want to crap all over your fans who shell out crazy amounts of money to see you in all route corners of the globe, I just want say goodbye.

I'm done, no more moderation or posts

[Adje]

Stop telling me what I believe and what I stand for Romney is the only that can save the economic world. paranoia: persecution complex, delusions, obsession, psychosis.

Again it is you who told the World. You are all over the media last week.

you bigot : prejudiced, biased, partial, one-sided, sectarian, discriminatory; opinionated, dogmatic, intolerant, narrow-minded, blinkered, illiberal; racist, sexist, chauvinistic, jingoistic; warped, twisted, distorted.Look in the mirror Jerk !! I'm done with you and 97% of these jerks that are on this site. You have know idea what you are talking about .
You really have a way with words. Just because I pointed out what it is that you stand for with your endorsement? Wow.

But if you're going that road, here is one for you
I
see dumb people !!
Stop using a mirror then :twisted:

[AndrewG]

All of you seem to have it wrong , you hate me , you hurt me , you have nothing to add about anything I do but negative comments . So good get out !!
Good, all revvedup left the building !!!
Don't let the door hit you in the ass !!

We don't hate you at all. We hate a lot of the things you've said here. You said yourself you would defend everyone's freedom of speech. So people are rightfully disagreeing with your Romney endorsement. It's a sensitive issue. Considering most of Europe is pro Obama, this is what you get. You're saying some right nasty things about some of your most deification fans. This dedication does not automatically mean they will agree with your political views.

[White of High]

Who the f*** cares about stupid American politics? Does it matter if Obama or Romney is the president? They are well controlled marionetts by background bas***ds. Anybody is president of US or any other country, they must have a nice smile, perfect teeth and long tongue. That's it. And who is loyal to anyone is just out of game...

Any news about the new album?

[Fire Ball]

Again it is you who told the World. You are all over the media last week.


You really have a way with words. Just because I pointed out what it is that you stand for with your endorsement? Wow.

But if you're going that road, here is one for you

Stop using a mirror then :twisted:

Go to Bruce Springsteen's site and kiss his ass !

[TheDoode]

This isn't exactly what I expected today; just logged on to read the news about the new album :-/

[Fire Ball]

We don't hate you at all. We hate a lot of the things you've said here. You said yourself you would defend everyone's freedom of speech. So people are rightfully disagreeing with your Romney endorsement. It's a sensitive issue. Considering most of Europe is pro Obama, this is what you get. You're saying some right nasty things about some of your most deification fans. This dedication does not automatically mean they will agree with your political views.

Not talking about Romney , I read the thread about my voice... It was so mean and hurtful that at that point,I knew their were no real fans on this site !

[Adje]

Go to Bruce Springsteen's site and kiss his ass !

I can also go to Madonna's site... Why would I do that?

And why do you say we are no fans? Recently the new DVD got all sorts of positive reviews on here. Where were you to accept those?

You're voice on the ROmney thing, it's all over the media. It's big news. Should we ignore that you sounded the way you did? It was your choice to go out there the way you did. Not ours.

[Sarge]

Just when I wondered about the whereabouts of the obligatory Springsteen reference...

[Fire Ball]

If all of you can be mean and hateful why can't I.. Your excuse for being so hateful is always I am entitled to my opinion !! Well the dog just bit back !!

Not talking about Romney , I read the thread about my voice... It was so mean and hurtful that at that point,I knew their were no real fans on this site !

[TheDoode]

Not talking about Romney , I read the thread about my voice... It was so mean and hurtful that at that point,I knew their were no real fans on this site !

I started that thread and it was not intended to be either mean or hurtful IN ANY WAY. Acknowledge it or not, your voice has changed a lot during your career, and people are always going to want to talk about that. I don't think anyone has said anything resoundingly hurtful or negative in that thread??

People love you here, man. You have to believe it. A lot of people love the way you sing right now, and some people don't. Big deal. Wouldn't taking on board the constructive stuff and dismissing the outright negative be the way to go?

I for one am looking forward to the new album.

[JennaG]

Not talking about Romney , I read the thread about my voice... It was so mean and hurtful that at that point,I knew their were no real fans on this site !

I know that I said nothing critical of your voice on that thread nor did I state a preference for your voice in a certian era. I actually remember saying something along the lines of there being something within your voice that I just love regardless of whatever 'era' the recording is from. I still stand by that statement because for me it is the truth.

[White of High]

I just saw right now the "performance" with Romney! Hillarious!!! It will be in all new year TV montage! :)

[Fire Ball]

I can also go to Madonna's site... Why would I do that?

And why do you say we are no fans? Recently the new DVD got all sorts of positive reviews on here. Where were you to accept those?

You're voice on the ROmney thing, it's all over the media. It's big news. Should we ignore that you sounded the way you did? It was your choice to go out there the way you did. Not ours.

WE did stand in the Storm and Break it , why didn't they play those they were great. There were no monitors on American, didn't even know the song started.( I KNOW JUST ANOTHER EXCUSE )wrong key , I didn't want to go up there . The guy from Alabama was so out of tune , I just reached to help him. Had know Idea where we were in the song ever. My mike was so loud you could not hear the music. Did anyone say that guy was in the key of Mars. No they just picked on me . Just like all of you did , so stuff. My shows before Sandy where great but I'm sure you think they suck along with all the other non fans on this site.
I agree with 25% of what Romney is credited with saying , which he didn't . Obama got ask what is favorite Ice cream was.
KID ROCK IS THE VOICE OF ROMNEY !!

[Sarge]

I wonder why there are still people who try to discuss in a reasonable way. It's pretty obvious where the road goes, isn't it?

[Fire Ball]

YET ANOTHER JERK HEARD FROM !!

I just saw right now the "performance" with Romney! Hillarious!!! It will be in all new year TV montage! :)

[LuuuuvMeat]

This thread has bummed me out for the day and it's only 9:55 am.

[Adje]

WE did stand in the Storm and Break it , why didn't they play those they were great. There were no monitors on American, didn't even know the song started.( I KNOW JUST ANOTHER EXCUSE )wrong key , I didn't want to go up there . The guy from Alabama was so out of tune , I just reached to help him. Had know Idea where we were in the song ever. My mike was so loud you could not hear the music. Did anyone say that guy was in the key of Mars. No they just picked on me . Just like all of you did , so stuff. My shows before Sandy where great but I'm sure you think they suck along with all the other non fans on this site.
I agree with 25% of what Romney is credited with saying , which he didn't . Obama got ask what is favorite Ice cream was.

Meat, you are part of this business for 40 years. You know how it works. You knew that if you go out on a rally like this and mess up one way or the other it bites you back.

Again, people here have been only positive on the GP DVD performance. Even myself (surprised?) Focus on that. and if you screw up (no matter who is to blaim for that) accept it's talked about.

This board has shown so much love to you, embrace that. Instead of kicking around.

You might hate me, but there are plenty here that 'need your love' and who deserve that with their unconditional siport.

Then there are plenty who tell it as they see it. That's not hate, that's their (our) sense of reality. Still they buy your cd's, go to your shows and take time to log in and talk about you.

It's not all black and white ;)

[White of High]

This topic is far the best from the start of mlukfc. ;) I love when musicans, actors and other artists are standing next to a politican and play the game for money. :lol:

[Sebastian.]

This topic is far the best from the start of mlukfc. ;) I love when musicans, actors and other artists are standing next to a politican and play the game for money. :lol:

Stop trying to wind him up.


Anyway,

I can't wait for the tour especially FCOL, I mean that will just blow everything away, and a new album just tops everyhting off.

[White of High]

What I can suggest go back to music and forget this performance. And if you are not on any side nobody will find you! ;)

[Fire Ball]

I have never done one thing in 48 years for money. Being on that stage will get me blackballed in Hollywood , already got blackballed from Letterman 3 years ago because USA today listed me as a Republican. Which is not true ! Romney understands Business, don't believe all the left wing BS. He will do more for the economy in 2 years than Obama could in 20 years.

This topic is far the best from the start of mlukfc. ;) I love when musicans, actors and other artists are standing next to a politican and play the game for money. :lol:

[Sarge]

[...] don't believe all the left wing BS.

And believe somebody else's BS instead? :twisted:

[White of High]

One thing I learned, presidents and politicans don't do economy. You and me do! Forget these clowns!

[BoyBehindBars]

Dear Meat,

I am a fan of yours for "only" 10 years now, but considering my age of 23 it's almost half of my life. You and Jim Steinman brought the joy of music to me, helped me through rough times etc. I attended every tour since then. Some concerts were good, some others even better.
Reading the announcement of your upcoming UK tour made me feel happy and I was ready to attend it (I am from Germany).
But now I have to reconsider that after all your insults.

You think we hate you and your music just because we dare to critizise you, your songs or your voice?
What kind of fans do you want? Blind, deaf and uncritical ones?...

Can't you see what you are doing here? You are hurting the people who love you most. Because of them you are where you are. Even though you seem to have forgotten that little fact.

I feel sorry for YOU and for myself.

Good luck anyway. (Although you prabably wouldn't want to hear that from me)!

[Dave]

All I can say is I am thankful for all of the music and look forward to whatever we are given in the future. I love a lot of the unlovable in Meat Loaf's career and find it horribly embarrassing to come on this site and read a lot of the comments here, and the rude things that people say to the point I just stop reading most of the time.

I want you to know that a lot of you have gone a long way to hurt the fandom and should be ashamed of yourselves. I do not blame Meat Loaf at all for his posts today. There is only so much you can take. Personally, there are some songs that I do not like as well as others, but I do not take time out of my busy life to flog the dead horse with continuous "lesbian love" jokes or the like. There is only so much a person can take before they snap, and you all have gone way beyond that and deserve all you are taking.

I will never forget in my entire life the first time I was fortunate enough to have met Meat Loaf. It was at the Lima County Fair in Lima, OH. He knew me before we were even introduced, looked me in the eyes and said "I have been looking forward to meeting with you" and proceeded to talk with the small group of us so long that his personal assistants were begging him to let us leave so they could get him ready for the show. There was another moment...it was in Cleveland, OH and Katrina had just hit. Meat Loaf was doing a special show to raise money for the victims. They were taking people in groups of two up to meet Meat, Jules and I were two of the last people to go up. He looked at us and immediately said something like "we have got to help these people" and begged us to take to the Internet to get people to buy tickets to the show, even if they could not attend, that the band, crew, and venue were all donating their services and 100% of the ticket money was going directly to the Red Cross for Katrina relief. I saw first-hand the urgency in his eyes...the same urgency to do the right thing that he had during his time on Celebrity Apprentice.

I also have not known Meat Loaf to be anything less than 100% of a advocate for GLBT rights. His tours are lauded in gay media as being some of the most gay-friendly entertainment options. He was heralded for recording Stephen Trask's anthem Tear Me Down by gay media globally. Meat Loaf has lent his name to GLBT fundraising events. Anyone who believes Meat Loaf is anti-gay, homophobic, or anything similar is simply a liar. There is no kind way to say it. They are a liar.

Anyone who is concerned about any backlash they are getting from Meat Loaf should really consider just how mean and cruel their words are to him. Just because someone is a celebrity does not make them a saint, and as an ordained minister...the last time I checked, there was only one perfect person who walked the Earth and that was Jesus.

Go ahead and flame me, crucify me, say what you want and dissect this post to the bitter end. I won't defend it, I won't go round and round about it, it is my thoughts and I am not apologetic for anything I have said. How do you like that with your afternoon tea?

Now, maybe stop wasting the time and energy focusing on badmouthing others and use your resources for improving yourself and the world around you? If we all did that...the world would be a far better place. Spread love/not venom.

[LuuuuvMeat]

Romney understands Business


Romney understands business at the expense of 99% of the American public.

His business history shows it. You can look it up anywhere. He is for himself and inner circle of family, friends and "church." That's the sad FACT.

[evil nickname]

Gee, the one time I really would like to press a dislike-button, I can't, because it isn't there. Well, too bad.

As for mr. Loaf telling me to put my head back up my ass, I don't care, as he recognizes that I'm always a little ray of sunshine. I'll take what I can get. But what I don't particulary care for is him telling fans to go to hell, calling them all kinds of names for disagreeing with him—after posting stuff on facebook about being for freedom of speech and touting tollerance of dissenting opinions, no surprise those being gone, though—posting the content of personal messages, and being plain rude? Poor form.

Meat, I still love you as an artist, but please, if you're not in your happy place, stay off the internet, for crying out loud.

[CarylB]

I have never done one thing in 48 years for money. Being on that stage will get me blackballed in Hollywood , already got blackballed from Letterman 3 years ago because USA today listed me as a Republican. Which is not true ! Romney understands Business, don't believe all the left wing BS. He will do more for the economy in 2 years than Obama could in 20 years.

And that's what I believe is your sole motivation. As Sebastion said, WoH is just trying to wind you up imo, as he has done often before.

Meat, I believe here are more here who support you than not. And I think you know that in your heart, even if they are not all as vocal as some. You have suffered a torrent of hate and abuse on FB the last few days, and I can understand why when you come here and see things that hurt your feelings it gets you over the edge. It would me.

But see how many have been asking about when you will come and tour here, see how excited most of us are. We will be there, and we stand behind you. Personally I thought the open letter was the height of rudeness, and I'd be appalled if someone were to do that to me .. and that's the honest truth. You are an intelligent man, concerned about your country's economy, and have researched the issues more than most, arguably any, here. Your choice is yours to make, and I respect that. Frankly when a country is staring down a financial abyss I think other issues (the ones people keep writing about ie women's choice, same sex marriage etc) which get the hype and media sound-bites, are overshadowed by the economy. Were I voting in this election that would be my only consideration, because if that fails, everything fails.

I do not see your support of the candidate you believe will be best placed to help your country deal with its biggest crisis means that you support everything he may stand for. Your integrity remains intact for me .. and for many of us.

There are more behind you, supporting you as the man you are, than there are those who either don't care, or forget about your feelings when they post about your work. Hold on to that.

Caryl

[CarylB]

All I can say is I am thankful for all of the music and look forward to whatever we are given in the future. I love a lot of the unlovable in Meat Loaf's career and find it horribly embarrassing to come on this site and read a lot of the comments here, and the rude things that people say to the point I just stop reading most of the time.

I want you to know that a lot of you have gone a long way to hurt the fandom and should be ashamed of yourselves. I do not blame Meat Loaf at all for his posts today. There is only so much you can take. Personally, there are some songs that I do not like as well as others, but I do not take time out of my busy life to flog the dead horse with continuous "lesbian love" jokes or the like. There is only so much a person can take before they snap, and you all have gone way beyond that and deserve all you are taking.

I am in accord Dave. Just would say not all have done this, but enough to wound, and I agree .. too much

Caryl

[Vickip]

All I can say is I am thankful for all of the music and look forward to whatever we are given in the future. I love a lot of the unlovable in Meat Loaf's career and find it horribly embarrassing to come on this site and read a lot of the comments here, and the rude things that people say to the point I just stop reading most of the time.

I want you to know that a lot of you have gone a long way to hurt the fandom and should be ashamed of yourselves. I do not blame Meat Loaf at all for his posts today. There is only so much you can take. Personally, there are some songs that I do not like as well as others, but I do not take time out of my busy life to flog the dead horse with continuous "lesbian love" jokes or the like. There is only so much a person can take before they snap, and you all have gone way beyond that and deserve all you are taking.

I will never forget in my entire life the first time I was fortunate enough to have met Meat Loaf. It was at the Lima County Fair in Lima, OH. He knew me before we were even introduced, looked me in the eyes and said "I have been looking forward to meeting with you" and proceeded to talk with the small group of us so long that his personal assistants were begging him to let us leave so they could get him ready for the show. There was another moment...it was in Cleveland, OH and Katrina had just hit. Meat Loaf was doing a special show to raise money for the victims. They were taking people in groups of two up to meet Meat, Jules and I were two of the last people to go up. He looked at us and immediately said something like "we have got to help these people" and begged us to take to the Internet to get people to buy tickets to the show, even if they could not attend, that the band, crew, and venue were all donating their services and 100% of the ticket money was going directly to the Red Cross for Katrina relief. I saw first-hand the urgency in his eyes...the same urgency to do the right thing that he had during his time on Celebrity Apprentice.

I also have not known Meat Loaf to be anything less than 100% of a advocate for GLBT rights. His tours are lauded in gay media as being some of the most gay-friendly entertainment options. He was heralded for recording Stephen Trask's anthem Tear Me Down by gay media globally. Meat Loaf has lent his name to GLBT fundraising events. Anyone who believes Meat Loaf is anti-gay, homophobic, or anything similar is simply a liar. There is no kind way to say it. They are a liar.

Anyone who is concerned about any backlash they are getting from Meat Loaf should really consider just how mean and cruel their words are to him. Just because someone is a celebrity does not make them a saint, and as an ordained minister...the last time I checked, there was only one perfect person who walked the Earth and that was Jesus.

Go ahead and flame me, crucify me, say what you want and dissect this post to the bitter end. I won't defend it, I won't go round and round about it, it is my thoughts and I am not apologetic for anything I have said. How do you like that with your afternoon tea?

Now, maybe stop wasting the time and energy focusing on badmouthing others and use your resources for improving yourself and the world around you? If we all did that...the world would be a far better place. Spread love/not venom.

Thank you Dave
:heart:

[LuuuuvMeat]

I also have not known Meat Loaf to be anything less than 100% of a advocate for GLBT rights. His tours are lauded in gay media as being some of the most gay-friendly entertainment options. He was heralded for recording Stephen Trask's anthem Tear Me Down by gay media globally. Meat Loaf has lent his name to GLBT fundraising events. Anyone who believes Meat Loaf is anti-gay, homophobic, or anything similar is simply a liar. There is no kind way to say it. They are a liar.





As far as I know and read no one said he was anti gay, No one. I believe you've missed the point of the other closed thread.

[Sarge]

posting the content of personal messages

I just noticed that a mod "liked" that particular post. So obviously there are mods who condone the violation of forum rules. :??:

[AndrewG]

I just noticed that a mod "liked" that particular post. So obviously there are mods who condone the violation of forum rules. :??:

Indeed I noticed that too. Coupled with those particular views of said mod it's shocking really.

[CarylB]

As far as I know and read no one said he was anti gay, No one. I believe you've missed the point of the other closed thread.

I don't think Dave has missed the point at all. Meat's support of gay marriage was repeatedly questioned, the inference being he was going against what he had always said, so in supporting Romney he was aligning with homophobic views etc .. I believe the word "hypocrite" was used several times.. The "open letter" tells him not to say he still believes in these issues but thinks the economy is too important, because if he does then these issues can't be important to him.

[Dave]

........ Okay, i was under the impression that new album news would go down well...

Not around here. It will be just another project to dissect and let the artist know what he did wrong on it.

[The Flying Mouse]

:twisted: Would it help if I were to ask people to get back on topic? :bleh:

Tongue lodged firmly in cheek there, just in case nobody got that :wink:

I'll take a more thorough read through the last days posts before responding properly, but it saddens me very much to see Meat so upset and angry, and it hurts me equally to see a large group of the fan club insulted so badly by Meat :sad:

[LuuuuvMeat]

I don't think Dave has missed the point at all. Meat's support of gay marriage was repeatedly questioned, the inference being he was going against what he had always said, so in supporting Romney he was aligning with homophobic views etc .. I believe the word "hypocrite" was used several times.. The "open letter" tells him not to say he still believes in these issues but thinks the economy is too important, because if he does then these issues can't be important to him.


Hypocrite isn't the same as homophob.

[LuuuuvMeat]

:twisted: Would it help if I were to ask people to get back on topic? :bleh:

Tongue lodged firmly in cheek there, just in case nobody got that :wink:

I'll take a more thorough read through the last days posts before responding properly, but it saddens me very much to see Meat so upset and angry, and it hurts me equally to see a large group of the fan club insulted so badly by Meat :sad:

Sorry, I was responding to Carly. I won't continue.

[The Flying Mouse]

:twisted: One thing I have done is removed the content of the private message.

We have a policy of not allowing the content of PM's be published on the site without the consent of the sender and receiver. That's why they are private messages.

Anybody who receives a PM they have a problem with (be it insulting or unfair) they can take it up with a mod. If it's a od involved, they can take it up with R.


A relitivly small issue, I know (sort of like turning the stove off while the house is burning down :doh: ) but it's a start :shrug:

[Monstro]

:twisted: One thing I have done is removed the content of the private message.



Already gone

[The Flying Mouse]

Sorry, I was responding to Carly. I won't continue.



Tongue lodged firmly in cheek there, just in case nobody got that :wink:


:twisted: :wink:

I don't think a "go back on topic please" post is going to work on this thread :sad
The thread is way beyond that sadly.
It's nice that somebody can take a "back on topic" message seriously though lol.

I'm going to have to have a proper look at all the posts before I can respond to this thread properly.

Why does this shit need to happen on a Sunday? :doh:
I better get the coffee on :coffee:

[The Flying Mouse]

Already gone

:twisted: We've either edited at the same time, or there was more than one post with a PM posted in.

[BostonAngel]

We don't hate you at all. We hate a lot of the things you've said here. You said yourself you would defend everyone's freedom of speech. So people are rightfully disagreeing with your Romney endorsement. It's a sensitive issue. Considering most of Europe is pro Obama, this is what you get. You're saying some right nasty things about some of your most deification fans. This dedication does not automatically mean they will agree with your political views.

Very well said. It wasn't even the political endorsement that sent me over the edge. It was the fact that any who posted disagreement or disappointment with that endorsement on his Facebook page got their comments deleted. IT became one big happy love fest for Romney. A friend from another country said "when I looked at Meat's FB book it looked like 100% of the US would be voting for Romney." He had the rght to have an opinion and have his say, yet his fans had no right to express their feelings; goes against what he says he stands for. Action speak louder than words. Then to make it look even worse, he just deleted any & all references to politics at all. He makes a bold, controversial political endorsment and says that you should fight with friends & family to get them to vote for Romney, Then deletes ALL political references. He jumped into the political fray and the negatvity that goes with it by endorsing someone. Yet when the understandable aftermath started, he couldn't deal with it in an adult, respectful manner.
Insulting 97% of your fan base and calling them names isn't helping to win back fans either. Right now his behavior reminds me of a two year old whose mommy just told him NO so the kid throws a major temper tantrum. That's how I see it.
I would say it to his face, however I am one of those people that, in his own words, wouldn't be allowed anywhere near a M&G. At this point I wouldn't even waste my money on a M&G. I hope that 97% of his fan base will stay away. He can look out at empty arenas across the UK and in America when next to no one shows up.
So disappointed & upset in a man i once admired & respected.
Yeah, I won't let the door hit me on the way out either, as Meat said.
I will still love the music he has produced so far. Love the music, not the man

[Gez]

Politics and Religion, two causes of conflicts. Put on a good Meat album, a beer and chill guys :)

[AndrewG]

Not around here. It will be just another project to dissect and let the artist know what he did wrong on it.

Meat was the person who came on the board and brewed the negativity to begin with.

:twisted: Would it help if I were to ask people to get back on topic? :bleh:

You must be having a ~~~~ing laugh.

[BostonAngel]

Gee, the one time I really would like to press a dislike-button, I can't, because it isn't there. Well, too bad.

As for mr. Loaf telling me to put my head back up my ass, I don't care, as he recognizes that I'm always a little ray of sunshine. I'll take what I can get. But what I don't particulary care for is him telling fans to go to hell, calling them all kinds of names for disagreeing with him—after posting stuff on facebook about being for freedom of speech and touting tollerance of dissenting opinions, no surprise those being gone, though—posting the content of personal messages, and being plain rude? Poor form.

Meat, I still love you as an artist, but please, if you're not in your happy place, stay off the internet, for crying out loud.

I think this gets to the heart of the matter. I could have just liked the post but for me that wasn't enough. Agree 100%

[Guy]

Politics and Religion, two causes of conflicts. Put on a good Meat album, a beer and chill guys :)
Ching....thats the sound of the beer bottle top hittin the floor. :0)

[The Flying Mouse]

You must be having a ~~~~ing laugh.

:twisted: Yes, yes I was.

Did you not read this part of the post?


Tongue lodged firmly in cheek there, just in case nobody got that :wink:


Or see the shifty looking smilie?

:bleh:


That's the second time somebody has taken that post seriously. :wtf: :lol:

As i've said before, this isn't a thread that's going to be resolved that easily.

[loaferman61]

Wow. I miss a couple of days, log-in to see news of a new CD. Think how great that news is, then open the thread to see all this. Meat, if you read the Romney thread not everyone was negative about your endorsement though admittedly we were in the minority. I buy your albums for the music, what you choose to do is your right and I support that. If people want to not buy your music that is also their choice. I for one am just happy to hear a new CD is coming soon.

[TheDoode]

As as already been requested, back to topic please, this isn't the place to discuss US or World Politics or economics.

But if Meat Loaf wants to come on here and scream at a load of people, that's just fine...?:??:

[Evil One]

Lol it would have been nice
Insulting 97% of your fan base is an interesting promotional technique.

[Fire Ball]

That is just not True , That is nothing but left wing spin... He saved Staples, Best Buy, Home Depot and at least 10 others I can't remember off the top of my head. There was a TV broadcast here where the CEO's of Staples, Best Buy and Home Depot stated they would have been put out of Business if it were not for Romney and Bain.How many stores and employees do they have ? They also said the number of regulations that have been put in place by executive order by Obama, that they would not be able to start their company today with the Regulations that have been put in place in the last 3 years. Let me tell you about an accountant in Chicago who quit and started a small farm. He did well, so he thought ,I going to open a small farm family style Restaurant , he did when he opened it he had 500 pages of regulations that 1 Lawyer could handle all the paper work. This was 2007, in 2011 it closed because of EPA he now had 6000 pages of regulations. Obama says he has created 5 million jobs , true but almost 90% are government jobs with over 2 million EPA officers, who now must Justify the Jobs. You friend have been Brainwashed by left wing spin. You look up the truth about Romney .With Obama we are heading for a world depression. THis 1% BS , wow !! I am not in the 1% that is for sure. It worked for Obama Class warfare !! or least he tried , we will see !! Show me anywhere New York Times LOL !! Romney understands business at the expense of 99% of the American public.

His business history shows it. You can look it up anywhere. He is for himself and inner circle of family, friends and "church." That's the sad FACT.

[suzieq]

Insulting 97% of your fan base is an interesting promotional technique.

Let's be clear 97% that are on this site, NOT of his whole fan base ;) But that's off topic again.

[MarkS]

Politics and Religion, two causes of conflicts. Put on a good Meat album, a beer and chill guys :)

The cause of every major war since the beginning of time. They say greed is the root of all evil, and if that is true, politics and religion are 1 point behind in second place. Everybody just chill out and go to your happy place.

Truthfully, it doesn't matter if Romney or Obama wins the election, they are essentially cut from the same cloth. America is to "Hell in a Handbasket" (see what I did there, HIAHB...segway) either way, because neither of these guys has what it takes to pull the nose up on this plummeting plane.

Meat, loved you since I discovered you. Will continue to do so, regardless of who you endorse or believe in. Can't wait for another new album.

[Fire Ball]

When I feel insulted by 97% , Yep ! Got more insults here, a fan club than I did on Face book !! You tell me ?Insulting 97% of your fan base is an interesting promotional technique.

[Sebastian.]

When I feel insulted by 97% , Yep ! Got more insults here, a fan club than I did on Face book !! You tell me ?

I'm sorry you feel that way, Meat. I'm sure nobody really means to hurt you.

I mean you do get a lot of positive stuff, hell I sent you a PM the otherday thanking you for something (which I hope you read)... For what it's worth I love you voice/music/everything. Can't wait to see and meet you next year!

[Adje]

When I feel insulted by 97% , Yep ! Got more insults here, a fan club than I did on Face book !! You tell me ?

Is it because you banned and deleted the post(ers)there? You tell me.

[The Flying Mouse]

:twisted: As i've said on the other thread, i'm going to go through this thread to try and clean it up a little.
It'll be reopened shortly.

I don't expect to be deleting much because it's not my intention to censor anybodys opinions. I only want to delete anything that is out of place or prevents the on topic direction of the thread.

In the meantime, let me say there is a general lack of mutual respect shown on the thread.
From all sides.

Less of the mudslinging, insults and jibes please.
This is a forum used by sane, rational, respectful and responsible adults.
Please let us all act that way.

[Fire Ball]

I deleted as many Romney as I did Obama, if fact the only one left up and is still up is an Obama ad. Now you know why I get upset , what you stated is not the truth !! I dealt with it in a very adult manner. You tried but the door hit you in the ass. This is called weeding out the fakes , impostors, frauds , and insincere. You didn't look, your friend did . It did not look like 100% of America would be voting for Romney. The arenas will not be empty. This next show will be one of the most special we have ever done. I can add Liar to your list . The door did hit you in the ass and the door knob is still stuck in there. We are equal I don't like you much either and I am one of the most uncomplicated, undemanding, unchallenging, effortless, painless, trouble-free, facile, simple, straightforward, elementary; informal easy as pie, a piece of cake, child's play, kids' stuff, a cinch, no sweat, a breeze, smooth sailing, duck soup, a snap to get along with. One exception when attacked I will fight tooth and nail. You sir are a coward. you run away !! "A FRIEND SAID" what a joke !!


Originally Posted by BostonAngel
Very well said. It wasn't even the political endorsement that sent me over the edge. It was the fact that any who posted disagreement or disappointment with that endorsement on his Facebook page got their comments deleted. IT became one big happy love fest for Romney. A friend from another country said "when I looked at Meat's FB book it looked like 100% of the US would be voting for Romney." He had the rght to have an opinion and have his say, yet his fans had no right to express their feelings; goes against what he says he stands for. Action speak louder than words. Then to make it look even worse, he just deleted any & all references to politics at all. He makes a bold, controversial political endorsment and says that you should fight with friends & family to get them to vote for Romney, Then deletes ALL political references. He jumped into the political fray and the negatvity that goes with it by endorsing someone. Yet when the understandable aftermath started, he couldn't deal with it in an adult, respectful manner.
Insulting 97% of your fan base and calling them names isn't helping to win back fans either. Right now his behavior reminds me of a two year old whose mommy just told him NO so the kid throws a major temper tantrum. That's how I see it.
I would say it to his face, however I am one of those people that, in his own words, wouldn't be allowed anywhere near a M&G. At this point I wouldn't even waste my money on a M&G. I hope that 97% of his fan base will stay away. He can look out at empty arenas across the UK and in America when next to no one shows up.
So disappointed & upset in a man i once admired & respected.
Yeah, I won't let the door hit me on the way out either, as Meat said.
I will still love the music he has produced so far. Love the music, not the man

[The Flying Mouse]

:twisted: As promised, editing and deleting has been kept to a bare minimum.

The thread topic (as I see it) is this.........

This is Meat responding to criticicm (real or perceived) over his endorcement of Mitt Romney, and to a lesser degree, the thread about his voice.

Yes, it's a rather political thread, but I think that in fighting over politics among ourselves does little else to muddy the water in a already (naurally) opinionated thread.

We can argue the larger points of politics all day, but I see this thread as a means for Meat to answer the concerns of his endorcement.
That's a big enough subject for us all.

If we want to debate general politics among ourselves there is off topic, or even better, forums elsewhere on the net devoted to the subject.

I think the best way to treat this thread is that Meat is on the podium, and we are asking him questions. It's where we have the right to ask him questions, and he has the right to reply.

I'm not asking that we do not address each other (that would be pretty dumb on a forum :nuts: ) but that we keep the issue closer to Meat, his endorecement, and his response to us, rather than argue the bigger issues of politics among ourselves. I know that seems to contradict itself somewhat, but I think you know my meaning.

Again, I would ask of everyone to post in a respectul manner.
Harsh things have been said, and they are still there to see (i've said it was not my intention to censor anyone) but what has been said has been said. Please contine the thread from here with, if not agreement, the type of respect that is afforded by the users of this forum.
Meat deserves respect, and so does his fans.

One thing we insist upon on this forum is respecful posting. If the thread continues in an inflamatory manner, it will be locked.

Thank you, and rock on.
Each and every one of you :metal:

[LuuuuvMeat]

That is just not True , That is nothing but left wing spin... He saved Staples, Best Buy, Home Depot and at least 10 others I can't remember off the top of my head. There was a TV broadcast here where the CEO's of Staples, Best Buy and Home Depot stated they would have been put out of Business if it were not for Romney and Bain.How many stores and employees do they have ? They also said the number of regulations that have been put in place by executive order by Obama, that they would not be able to start their company today with the Regulations that have been put in place in the last 3 years. Let me tell you about an accountant in Chicago who quit and started a small farm. He did well, so he thought ,I going to open a small farm family style Restaurant , he did when he opened it he had 500 pages of regulations that 1 Lawyer could handle all the paper work. This was 2007, in 2011 it closed because of EPA he now had 6000 pages of regulations. Obama says he has created 5 million jobs , true but almost 90% are government jobs with over 2 million EPA officers, who now must Justify the Jobs. You friend have been Brainwashed by left wing spin. You look up the truth about Romney .With Obama we are heading for a world depression. THis 1% BS , wow !! I am not in the 1% that is for sure. It worked for Obama Class warfare !! or least he tried , we will see !! Show me anywhere New York Times LOL !!





A business first policy by definition is exclusionary. What's best for business is not necessary best for the country nor the economy. This mentality is what got us into this mess in the first place. Regulating industries such as banks, wall street, and oil should happen, IMO. They are part of the problem in this country. It's not a coincidence the businesses you listed are in the service industry, i.e. low paying jobs that make a ton of executives rich.

Fyi, I'm a centrist. Always have been. I believe in FAIRNESS for all!

[JennaG]

The arenas will not be empty. This next show will be one of the most special we have ever done.

And I have every faith in that. I'm so excited already that I want to happy dance around the room.

:cheer: :cheer:

[robgomm]

The one thing I want to say to you Meat is that it might feel like it's 97% screwing you on this site, but in reality it's not. I like to think most of us here love you and respect you and have your back for whatever choices you choose to make in your life.

Personally i think it's just outright dumb to accuse you of being anti this or anti that for supporting someone. Over here in the UK everyone who votes can probably agree with me that they don't agree with everything their chosen party does or says. We usually end up choosing the lesser of two evils, and like you say, it's who is best for the time. I don't really know enough about the differences between Obama and Romney to make an informed opinion, but I know for sure that it's a democracy, and you should not be getting this amount of shit thrown your way just for exercising your democratic rights.

You're right the arenas will NOT be empty, they will be packed out, and you know why? Because we always have, and always will love you in the UK, and US politics has no bearing on that. You have always been popular here and these issues do not interest 99% of the UK public because we have enough problems with our own politics lol.

[Adje]

I deleted as many Romney as I did Obama, I dealt with it in a very adult manner.

Well I guess I saw it wrong too. Because you deleted them EVENTUALLY. But not initially. In fact (and I wish I had made caps) you even replied to one guy, whoms post was deleted already, and called him a moron. I know you deleted two of my posts but kept the pro-Romney replies up for at least 4 days after my posts were gone (perhaps longer but I didn't check in after those days. They are all gone now though

I have to say that you are not completely truthful here

[markyboy1985]

Jesus Christ why are people attacking meat and giving him abuse and all round negative comments and judgements? This man is a legend who I've had pleasure of meeting twice! He's working his socks off to please his fans and some folk come on ere and give him abuse all because he's siding with a presidential candidate. He's entitled to vote for who he likes. In uk i hate the conservatives but if meat stood up and sided with them I wouldn't turn against meat. This abuse and negativity aimed at meat is disgusting. I for one think he's a legend and I don't care what say about his voice I loved his latest dvd it was awesome can't wait to see you on tour in uk I'll be standing there supporting you! Thank you for all the music over the years!

[carole]

All of you seem to have it wrong , you hate me , you hurt me , you have nothing to add about anything I do but negative comments . So good get out !!
Good, all revvedup left the building !!!
Don't let the door hit you in the ass !!

I could never hate you Meat. You will always have my love and support, no matter what. You have given me years of pleasure listening to your music and the few times I met you you have always been gracious and kind. Your political stance is of no concern to me.

Carole

[Sarge]

This is a tragicomedy...

[Fire Ball]

Trust me I am well aware it was the fans who bought the Records ,Tickets and supported me. Then I don't do what they like they tell me you suck, F you, I'm burning your records, tearing up your tickets. You do as we say , you have no right to disagree with us .. WE made you. I worked my ass for 48 years sold over 100 million records and have paid less than 2% for them . It's part of the Business so I'm not bitter. The one thing I do not have to put up with is insults.
I will fight , would not still be here if I did not fight .
Meat
Dear Meat,

I am a fan of yours for "only" 10 years now, but considering my age of 23 it's almost half of my life. You and Jim Steinman brought the joy of music to me, helped me through rough times etc. I attended every tour since then. Some concerts were good, some others even better.
Reading the announcement of your upcoming UK tour made me feel happy and I was ready to attend it (I am from Germany).
But now I have to reconsider that after all your insults.

You think we hate you and your music just because we dare to critizise you, your songs or your voice?
What kind of fans do you want? Blind, deaf and uncritical ones?...

Can't you see what you are doing here? You are hurting the people who love you most. Because of them you are where you are. Even though you seem to have forgotten that little fact.

I feel sorry for YOU and for myself.

Good luck anyway. (Although you prabably wouldn't want to hear that from me)!

[ninja]

@ Meat: just don't have the right words to tell you how much I love you - for your personality even more than for your outstanding work!!!
I haven't been here for some days and I'm really shocked now and upset about what's going on here. Seems to me like being on a hate-forum.
You give so much to so many people and it hurts me that quite a bit of them don't seem to deserve it.
I've met you for the first time in Philly at the M&G and it was better than I ever could imagine.
You are really someone special!!!
Irene

[robgomm]

Hey Meat can I ask a question? One thing I was interested in was Obamas healthcare bill. How does that actually work? I know there was a lot of controversy about it and it was hard for him to get it passed. Is it like our NHS in the UK where the taxpayers money goes towards it and it's a free service for everyone?

[Fire Ball]

Can't you see the people who say they love me, are hurting me !! I came to read some good things and all I got was the same as those Libs wrote me, you suck. I came to visit my friends , found out different.
M
Dear Meat,

I am a fan of yours for "only" 10 years now, but considering my age of 23 it's almost half of my life. You and Jim Steinman brought the joy of music to me, helped me through rough times etc. I attended every tour since then. Some concerts were good, some others even better.
Reading the announcement of your upcoming UK tour made me feel happy and I was ready to attend it (I am from Germany).
But now I have to reconsider that after all your insults.

You think we hate you and your music just because we dare to critizise you, your songs or your voice?
What kind of fans do you want? Blind, deaf and uncritical ones?...

Can't you see what you are doing here? You are hurting the people who love you most. Because of them you are where you are. Even though you seem to have forgotten that little fact.

I feel sorry for YOU and for myself.

Good luck anyway. (Although you prabably wouldn't want to hear that from me)!

[Fire Ball]

That is the Basic Idea , but it really is about the math. 315 million americans and not enough Doctors to make it work on a National Level. On a State Level it could work, They have to pass a law that would allow you to live in NY and be able to buy Insurance in Iowa. There should be HC for all , I read 1400 pages of a 2200 page bill . I wanted to throw it across the room.
Meat

Hey Meat can I ask a question? One thing I was interested in was Obamas healthcare bill. How does that actually work? I know there was a lot of controversy about it and it was hard for him to get it passed. Is it like our NHS in the UK where the taxpayers money goes towards it and it's a free service for everyone?

[JennaG]

That is the Basic Idea , but it really is about the math. 315 million americans and not enough Doctors to make it work on a National Level. On a State Level it could work, They have to pass a law that would allow you to live in NY and be able to buy Insurance in Iowa. There should be HC for all , I read 1400 pages of a 2200 page bill . I wanted to throw it across the room.
Meat

Thank you for that information. I was wondering what it was all about.

I know very little about American politics so you'll have to forgive me. :oops:

[Sarge]

Can't you see the people who say they love me, are hurting me !! I came to read some good things and all I got was the same as those Libs wrote me, you suck. I came to visit my friends , found out different.
M

You just said that you hate 97 % of the people on this forum (several times !) and called them names in a way that would probably have resulted in a ban if it had been done by an "ordinary" user. You obviously have a very strange concept of "friendship".

[robgomm]

That is the Basic Idea , but it really is about the math. 315 million americans and not enough Doctors to make it work on a National Level. On a State Level it could work, They have to pass a law that would allow you to live in NY and be able to buy Insurance in Iowa. There should be HC for all , I read 1400 pages of a 2200 page bill . I wanted to throw it across the room.
Meat

So really they should have done the math before passing it then. No good bringing in a new system if you don't have the staff to support it. Sounds like you guys need major investment in training new Doctors, Nurses etc. They should have done that BEFORE the healthcare bill was passed.

[Fire Ball]

I agree most don't deserve it , but I had to start the fight to find the real enemies. When it ends the real fans will still be here and I will do something special for them . Was thinking when I came on that was going to invite all here to a dress Rehearsal in April. I would say 97% will be invited.
Meat

@ Meat: just don't have the right words to tell you how much I love you - for your personality even more than for your outstanding work!!!
I haven't been here for some days and I'm really shocked now and upset about what's going on here. Seems to me like being on a hate-forum.
You give so much to so many people and it hurts me that quite a bit of them don't seem to deserve it.
I've met you for the first time in Philly at the M&G and it was better than I ever could imagine.
You are really someone special!!!
Irene

[Guy]

First like? Do I get first dress rehearsal ticket Meat? Haha..........

[Sebastian.]

Meat, since we're on the topic of Healthcare...

I have to go to the US for 6 weeks to study in 2014. Overhere in the UK if anything went wrong and I was a tourist, then it owuld be free (although we're having problems with helath tourists now). What would happen if I fell ill during my time in the states, would I have to fork out thousands, or can I get some kind of inssurance? I've never really understood the US healthcare system.


On another note..

I hope you got my PM, and feel better!

[Deena J]

Was thinking when I came on that was going to invite all here to a dress Rehearsal in April. I would say 97% will be invited.
Meat



Staying out of the main part of this thread because I do not discuss politics ---not even with family. but I had to comment here...

That rehearsal idea would be awesome except I would have to work off the debt as part of the road crew (if Im lucky!) just to make it from southeast Arkansas to there & back home again (I assume you meant the UK). ;) :D

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[Sarge]

I had to start the fight to find the real enemies.

That post says it all. "Find the real enemies"? Are you proud of starting fights on fan forums?

[Fire Ball]

BINGO !!

So really they should have done the math before passing it then. No good bringing in a new system if you don't have the staff to support it. Sounds like you guys need major investment in training new Doctors, Nurses etc. They should have done that BEFORE the healthcare bill was passed.

[olblueeyes]

Can't you see the people who say they love me, are hurting me !! I came to read some good things and all I got was the same as those Libs wrote me, you suck. I came to visit my friends , found out different.
M


Can't argue with this. People seem to think they have a right to tell Meat what he should and shouldn't say or do. I'd be pissed off by this - when you go to a fan site, you don't expect to see the criticism that is evident here. Meat's 97% figure might be a bit off but I'd say there are a far greater proportion of people who are quick to criticise here than you'd see on many fan sites.

I stand by the rule, if you wouldn't say something to someone over a pint in a pub, why would you post it on their fan site?!

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[Adje]

Was thinking when I came on that was going to invite all here to a dress Rehearsal in April. I would say 97% will be invited.
Meat

I have been a part of the 97% from the very first post today so I CAN'T WAIT FOR MY INVITATION!

WOOOOHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO :lol:

Wembley, London would be nice. I can go by train then

[Fire Ball]

To find the enemies , Yes !! also I believe I said 97% hate me .
Love Sarge,
Meat
That post says it all. "Find the real enemies"? Are you proud of starting fights on fan forums?

[melon]

I agree most don't deserve it , but I had to start the fight to find the real enemies. When it ends the real fans will still be here and I will do something special for them . Was thinking when I came on that was going to invite all here to a dress Rehearsal in April. I would say 97% will be invited.
Meat

Oh to hell with just selling the spleen... anyone know where I can sell a spleen & kidney combo? I'm getting to the UK one way or the other, even if I have to fly with the sheep & cows!

[tonyloaf]

Meat don't mean to sound selfish and change subject but you really have made my start of the week happy with the news of a uk tour, and if you every did invites to rehearsal then what a great pleasure that would be

[Sebastian.]

Please Meat, I do hope that invite goes ahead. I mean that would just be... wow.. I mean just wow.

[Fire Ball]

Adje, you will be there you got balls and stood up to me and didn't take your ball and go home. Don't know where it will be right now won't know that till March
Love Ya,
Meat
I have been a part of the 97% from the very first post today so I CAN'T WAIT FOR MY INVITATION!

WOOOOHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO :lol:

Wembley, London would be nice. I can go by train then

[Guy]

Melon......if you fly British airways. That's exactly who you will be flying with. BA.....Bloody awful. :)

[Sarge]

I was wrong. This isn't a tragicomedy. It's just a tragedy.

[Adje]

Adje, you will be there you got balls and stood up to me and didn't take your ball and go home. Don't know where it will be right now won't know that till March
Love Ya,
Meat

You know, and you can have my word for it. I'll be there. If you let me in, that's up to you, but I never walked away from a disagreement. I haven't said a word on this board that I would not dare say to you -or anyone else- in their face.

So I guess you will see me ;)

[Sebastian.]

Meat, since we're on the topic of Healthcare...

I have to go to the US for 6 weeks to study in 2014. Overhere in the UK if anything went wrong and I was a tourist, then it owuld be free (although we're having problems with helath tourists now). What would happen if I fell ill during my time in the states, would I have to fork out thousands, or can I get some kind of inssurance? I've never really understood the US healthcare system.


On another note..

I hope you got my PM, and feel better!

Just remembered that thing called travel insurance. Ah, I am silly!

[melon]

Melon......if you fly British airways. That's exactly who you will be flying with. BA.....Bloody awful. :)

That bad huh? I don't care lol, Ima be there!

[Vickip]

Staying out of the main part of this thread because I do not discuss politics ---not even with family. but I had to comment here...

That rehearsal idea would be awesome except I would have to work off the debt as part of the road crew (if Im lucky!) just to make it from southeast Arkansas to there & back home again (I assume you meant the UK). ;) :D

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

I second that :D

[Wario]

This is insane. :| Dress rehearsal in april? for the 97% who "hate you"?

You have that backwards. 97% love you, 2.5% cant get past you arent ever gonna be like you were in 1987, and .05% are trolls.

Its politics not personal. I for one dont care. wouldve liked to hear how rescheduling beacon theater is going then this stuff. cant we all just be happy?

The current DVD, though it had some video compression issues and no mercury blues or all of me was still a masterpiece! lets not debate and go at eachother and be a happy fan club with ponies and roses.

:D

[Sebastian.]

This is insane. :| Dress rehearsal in april? for the 97% who "hate you"?

You have that backwards. 97% love you, 2.5% cant get past you arent ever gonna be like you were in 1987, and .05% are trolls.

Its politics not personal. I for one dont care. wouldve liked to hear how rescheduling beacon theater is going then this stuff. cant we all just be happy?

:D

This.

Also if this dress rehearsal does go ahead... I do hope we can have a fan club go at Bat Out of Hell on the stage! :lol:


Edit: Thanks Caryl! 2014 seems to be getting closer everyday so need to start looking at these things.

[melon]

This is insane. :| Dress rehearsal in april? for the 97% who "hate you"?

You have that backwards. 97% love you, 2.5% cant get past you arent ever gonna be like you were in 1987, and .05% are trolls.

:D

Read the thread Wario, he knows that ;)

[anotherday]

I will share my POST when home.

[CarylB]

I deleted as many Romney as I did Obama, if fact the only one left up and is still up is an Obama ad. Now you know why I get upset , what you stated is not the truth !! I dealt with it in a very adult manner.

Yes, you did

The arenas will not be empty. This next show will be one of the most special we have ever done.

That they won't .. Can't think why anyone would wish that .. but they'd be tilting at windmills. The arenas will be packed and the show will be spectacular :D

Caryl

[JennaG]

When it ends the real fans will still be here and I will do something special for them . Was thinking when I came on that was going to invite all here to a dress Rehearsal in April. I would say 97% will be invited.
Meat

I think I'd just about die and go to heaven if that were to happen and I were lucky enough to be invited. ;)

[Sarge]

he knows that

No, he doesn't - or he's playing a strange little game with us. Otherwise he wouldn't admit to intentionally start fights in order to "find enemies". Very strange way to interact with one's customers. It doesn't surprise me that long-time fans said goodbye.

[Sebastian.]

I'd hate to miss out on the rehearsal. If you go ahead with it are you going to make it an "open" invitation, Meat. Or will you select people. I only ask as it would just be a dream, I just hope I'm in the 97% that wiill get invited.

[loaferman61]

Can't argue with this. People seem to think they have a right to tell Meat what he should and shouldn't say or do. I'd be pissed off by this - when you go to a fan site, you don't expect to see the criticism that is evident here. Meat's 97% figure might be a bit off but I'd say there are a far greater proportion of people who are quick to criticise here than you'd see on many fan sites.

I stand by the rule, if you wouldn't say something to someone over a pint in a pub, why would you post it on their fan site?!

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

Good points. I think had Meat gone for Obama this would not be such an issue. Whereas to me had he done so, I would not be on here griping about it. I still buy Springsteen albums FFS. The fact is that all this Romney is going to send the US back to the 1950's is such BS. The American media cheerleads for him to such a shameless level and some people buy the hype and think Romney will starve Granny to death. Obama is a recent convert to gay marriage most for political reasons, actually he got there way after Meat did. Women's rights, code for abortion mainly, were mainly solidified in the 70's by roe v. wade. What exactly has Obama done for women's rights? He is far from being the champion of these causes. The emperor hides behind a facade of hype. People IMO need to get away from the mainstream media and think for themselves. If you say Romney will take anything from granny, women, or gays look into it and see if there is proof or did you hear it on TV. As for Meat look up Obama's sudden conversion to gay marriage support before the election then look at Meat's record and who was there first publicly?

[Fire Ball]

Sarge, I learned in the last few days some people who say they are fans are not. They are tourist I have a question for you, are you a writer?
M
No, he doesn't - or he's playing a strange little game with us. Otherwise he wouldn't admit to intentionally start fights in order to "find enemies". Very strange way to interact with one's customers. It doesn't surprise me that long-time fans said goodbye.

[Monstro]

I agree most don't deserve it , but I had to start the fight to find the real enemies. When it ends the real fans will still be here and I will do something special for them . Was thinking when I came on that was going to invite all here to a dress Rehearsal in April. I would say 97% will be invited.
Meat

What about those that aren't still here? There's two I know of both of whom never posted on your facebook wall or the voice thread yet both were dismissed as insignificant by you and now treated as an enemy because they took objection to being insulted. I've known them both for years and know neither of them deserved the treatment you gave them.

[robgomm]

Is there any actual evidence that Mitt Romney is anti-gay, anti womans choice etc? I have very little knowledge of this but from what I can tell all Republicans are tarred with this same brush which is unfair? It's stereotyping right?

[jessrover]

I must admit I have not fully understood the entire gist of this thread, but I can't wait for the UK tour and new album, I'm saving hard to get to as many venues as I can and a dress rehearsal sounds fantastic. Good luck with the knee ops Meat, see you next year. I have found all your tours brilliant and am amazed at the strength of your voice each and every year. :D keep on rocking :cool:

[AndrewG]

Is there any actual evidence that Mitt Romney is anti-gay, anti womans choice etc? I have very little knowledge of this but from what I can tell all Republicans are tarred with this same brush which is unfair? It's stereotyping right?

GRN9Y5Nvdqk

SzR6mobEe5Q

[LuuuuvMeat]

GRN9Y5Nvdqk

Thank you.

[Sarge]

I have a question for you, are you a writer?

No, I'm not. Why do you ask?

I have a question for you, too. What is your definition of "fan"? Is it something that can be measured? And why are you that eager to detect "enemies" on fan (!) forums and statements that you don't like while usually ignoring the positive stuff? What's the use of dividing your fanbase into "good" and "bad" fans? Do you like disharmony? Do you enjoy driving a wedge between people? How do you feel when people who have been faithful fans (no "tourists") for years are that hurt and put off by your comments that they decide to no longer spend their time, money and admiration on you and leave?

[robgomm]

GRN9Y5Nvdqk

SzR6mobEe5Q

Thanks for posting the video. Just to clarify is he talking just about marriages in church or marriages elsewhere? I'd also be interested if he is against civil partnerships and so on. Maybe he's against gay marriage in church but not elsewhere, maybe he's against gay marriage full stop but not civil partnerships. I don't think it's fair to maybe label him completely anti-gay unless we know the full facts. It might be that he has no problem with gay people at all, but he just believes that marriage should be specific in that way.

[JaysScout]

BINGO !!

BINGO !!

Quote:
Originally Posted by robgomm View Post
"So really they should have done the math before passing it then. No good bringing in a new system if you don't have the staff to support it. Sounds like you guys need major investment in training new Doctors, Nurses etc. They should have done that BEFORE the healthcare bill was passed."

The health care bill HAD to be passed quickly. Therefore, it was a mess, and not well thought out at all. Obama had 2 years to get it done. Why 2 years? That's how long he had a democrat controlled congress.....both the House and Senate. If it weren't done before 2010, when the republicans took control of the House, it never would have passed. Obama was more concerned about having a "political trophy" to put on his mantlepiece, than he was in having workable health care legislation.

[LuuuuvMeat]

Thanks for posting the video. Just to clarify is he talking just about marriages in church or marriages elsewhere? I'd also be interested if he is against civil partnerships and so on. Maybe he's against gay marriage in church but not elsewhere, maybe he's against gay marriage full stop but not civil partnerships. I don't think it's fair to maybe label him completely anti-gay unless we know the full facts. It might be that he has no problem with gay people at all, but he just believes that marriage should be specific in that way.

Any gay marriage. Civil partnerships are not the same a marriage. There are 1,011 different rights large and small that are not included in partnerships.

[The Flying Mouse]

:twisted: I've posted on the thread as a mod, here's my post as a fan, and a member of the community.

Meat.
I feel that the post at the start of this thread is untrue, and an unfair generalisation of the members here.

You seem to have made a rather large turnaround in recent posts that puzzles me. You seem to be saying that you had a larger game plan in mind here. I hope i'll understand when you explain it further.

You say that you were trying to weed out the enemies, and I say with all due repect, that that sounds rather paranoid.
This is a fan club dedicated to you. IMHO you have no enemies here.
You have fans who are more critical, but that is because they have high standards, and high expectations of you.
That does not make them your enemy.

The folks respect here (by and large) respect you as an artist, and wish you every success.

Assuming there are trolls in our community, it's a well know fact that trolls feed off provoking a negative emotional reaction. As your post was very negative and very emotional, it seems logical that it would be the trolls that were more likely to stay.

As to the issues thar prompted the post.

The voice thread.
I've got to say that I did a mental facepalm when I saw the thread appear.
I thought that no good could come of it.
But I was plesantly suprised by the level of discussion. The posts were written in an honest and respectul manner. Nobody said you'd lost it, you couldn't sing anymore, or that you sucked.
True, there were many posts that praised past performances (my own included) but I (and most other posters) also said they continue to enjoy your work, and continued to be thrilled by your work, both live and in the studio.

The Romney endorcement.
Any time somebody in the public eye backs a political party, they put their head over the parapet and risk being shot at. It's a fact of life.
I don't need to tell you this.
Romney, and people close to him in his party have some policies and ideals that many find offensive and prehistoric.
Some issues shadow the candidate so much that it often becomes all the candidate is about.
When Obama first ran the biggest issue seemed to be "does America want a black president". The little issue becomes the big issue.It's ludicrous, but it's how things are.
I know that it's impossible to stand on a podium at a political rally and say "this guys economic plan is great, but some of his ideas are bat shit" :nuts:

There was a discussion here about the endorcement, and people spoke their shock and suprise that you had backed him. Many because of some of his outdatted (and IMHO undemocratic) ideals.
It would have put many minds at rest if you had visited the forum and posted your own political views. Why you backed Romney, and what you didn't agree with. I know you did something simalar on Facebook, but a post here might have been helpful.
I'm not saying this because I know better than you, hindsight is a great general.
I don't believe that anybody genuinly, in their heart of hearts, ever thought you were against gay rights, womens rights, or agreed with statements that if a woman is raped and becomes pregnant, she is blessed by god. I think people just wanted the reassurance from you.

I saw myself the level of abuse you received on facebook, but you had nowhere near that level of abuse here. I know that for a fact, because it would have been deleted by myself or one of the other mods.
We would afford the same protection from abuse to any other one of our members.

OK, you've seen posts by people saying they don't want to be a fan anymore, and that point of view baffles me.
You're a great artist, but, again, with all due respect, your personal politics are not my concern. I would no more vote for my favourite artists political candidate than buy underwear based on what an actor says.
You have your opinion, and the right to express it. I repect that. I have the right not to care about your political leanings, listen to some f*cking great music, and drink a beer. :cheers:

The group performance.
It wasn't good.
You know that.
As you've explained, you didn't want to get up there. It wasn't practiced, and the set up wasn't right. This confirmed everything I believed (and posted) about the performance.
But if a chef spills the salt cellar on your meal, and then you eat it, you are going to send it back because it tastes bad. In general, nobody will give a damn it's just because the salt was spilled, they'll just know the food wasn't good. Most people don't want to know why the food is bad, they'll just judge the results.
Again, i'm telling you things you already know here :shrug:


The level of abuse you posted on the forum hurts me. On several levels.

It hurts me that you feel so little for this forum that means so much to me.

It hurts that you dismiss many of us fans as the "97%" that hate you.

It hurts that you hurt, and feel it us to blame for making you feel that way.


It hurts to see a true/loyal/real (take your pick, I don't like any of those terms) post something like this, because he is hurt by your scathing post.............


Hey meat,

I guess I'll be one of the 97% to not go to a show or a meet and greet or buy an album again.

My one meet and greet I went to you responded to me with 'f*** you that's not a question' when I started to talk to you about 'somebody loves me'

I took it as banter and a joke then but after reading what you've had to rant about today then I can safely say I wouldn't want to pay another £200 to do it again.

To me your best work of recent times was hang cool teddy bear and that's what I'd like to remember you for.

But because of this, and the fact that you seem to want to crap all over your fans who shell out crazy amounts of money to see you in all corners of the globe, I just want to say goodbye.

I'm done, no more moderation or posts

It hurts that your responce to this fan is this..............


Good, all revvedup left the building !!!
Don't let the door hit you in the ass !!

Mike is a long time fan of yours. He's been a mod here for a long time. He contributes a lot to the forum, and to the community. I don't believe i've ever read a post by him that has been unfairly critical.
Sad times to lose people like him. :sad:

I can understand his disillusionment. You say that we are saying that you suck, but you are the one telling us that we suck.
I don't want to deny you your feelings, but the hate you claim we have given to you has been revisited on us. In the harshest terms.


Sorry for the length of this post (if you're still reading) but it's the first i've written on the thread about how I feel on the subject.
I love ya Meat. You're still the best in the business, and you always bring the best.
I'm a fan for life, that's just the way it is :shrug:
If you want me carted out of a show, expect a fight, because I want to see the goddam show :wink:
Rock on :metal:
Neil

[JaysScout]

Sarge, I learned in the last few days some people who say they are fans are not. They are tourist I have a question for you, are you a writer?
M

Often it takes certain specific events to find out who your "friends" really are. I think I detect this here.

[loaferman61]

Obama in 2008: I believe marriage is the union between a man and a woman. As a Christian it's also a sacred union.
The naked emperor. At least Romney looked the man in the eye and answered him respectfully. As a Mormon and former missionary Romney is in the same boat as Obama is here, Romney just stayed consistent instead of changing just before the election.
Here is the video link
http://youtu.be/N6K9dS9wl7U

[AndrewG]

Thanks for posting the video. Just to clarify is he talking just about marriages in church or marriages elsewhere? I'd also be interested if he is against civil partnerships and so on. Maybe he's against gay marriage in church but not elsewhere, maybe he's against gay marriage full stop but not civil partnerships. I don't think it's fair to maybe label him completely anti-gay unless we know the full facts. It might be that he has no problem with gay people at all, but he just believes that marriage should be specific in that way.

Indeed, nowhere does it state he is anti gay really. However many would see a denial of gay marriage as a step backwards now, which I think is completely understandable. Take one step backward here and who knows what would follow.

[LucyK!]

Adje, you will be there you got balls and stood up to me and didn't take your ball and go home. Don't know where it will be right now won't know that till March
Love Ya,
Meat

You want balls? I'll give you balls my dear...

Mr Loaf...just over a month ago you logged on here, completely out of the blue, and wrote the most wonderful message to Andy and I before our wedding. From the bottom of my heart I will never be able to thank you enough for that (though I'll have fun trying :)) ) and the forum was filled with such positivity off the back of that post because people got a very personal glimpse of the real you.

Meat, I love you, but you drive me crazy! I mean, really crazy! There are people here who take great pleasure in poking the fire, simply because it provokes a response from you - all they want is "Fireball" quoting their posts, you give it to them, and in the process of doing so you make yourself angry and post things which turn a lot of people off.

It's nature to want to defend yourself but if we're honest I think you know that some (most) of those posts are pretty awful to read. I can't believe they're written by the same guy that wrote the post mentioned above.

I'm sorry you think that "97%" of people here are against you, but I'll tell you now Meat that you got it wrong - 97% here are completely behind you. People here sacrifice a lot to follow your tours, not because they have to but because they want to, so please don't forget that.

[The Flying Mouse]

:twisted: Again, can we try to keep to the more general subject of the thread rather than debate politics amongst ourselves?
The thread is quite hot as it is IMHO.
Not to mention how fast it's going. :panic:

To paraphare a f*cking great song, baby we can debate and argue all night, but that ain't getting us nowhere.

[robgomm]

I'd love to carry on chatting, but bed calls yawn. Night all.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Forum Runner

[clpmss]

I usually don't post on here, but Meat (Sir) I have to agree with you. The hc bill sucks. I know I work for a hospital. I'm not going to fight with you but Obama just might win because he was showing his face during this Hurricane. He has done nothing for me. My opinion and my vote with be for change. Romey I'm hoping will get the job done. We need jobs, homes not more debt. We have all been devastated this past week. Some of us, like me are still going thru it. If he was any kind of President, he should have helped everyone on Tuesday, not days later. I still owe you a piece of wedding cake. LOL!!!!

You still have my support and love
Chris:lol:



I agree most don't deserve it , but I had to start the fight to find the real enemies. When it ends the real fans will still be here and I will do something special for them . Was thinking when I came on that was going to invite all here to a dress Rehearsal in April. I would say 97% will be invited.
Meat

[The Flying Mouse]

:twisted: Time for another clean up.
I was going to leave some of the polital debate posts up there, but people can't resist answering them.

Locked while i'm doing it.

[The Flying Mouse]

:twisted: OK, last chance saloon for this thread.

The subject is Meat's post here aimed at his critics concerning the voice thread and his endorcement.

It's not a general political debate.
There are sites for that kind of debate.

I've left some of the vids up, and a quote from Obama, because they are answering questions concerning the candidates. This has got at least some relevance here because Meat has made an endorcement.

So questions about policy, and direct answers to those questions using quotes from the candidate as source material, fair enough, but quit the in fighting on politics please.

Any more, the thread is history.

[wizardofodd]

Well this has been a very interesting read hasn't it? Meat it seems you've come on here with a rage (have calmed down since) but all I can say is this- for the people who have attacked you personally with horrible comments you have every right to fire back! but remember this, if somebody doesn't agree with your political ideology, beliefs and who you support doesn't make then any less of a fan. The election has divided your nation and will divide your fan base. I love you as a singer, actor and as a person but I disagree with your judgement to endorse an individual who I have political differences with and I stand by my belief that endorsing a candidate makes it appear that you side with Romney on every political point, socially and economically. I am sure you expected to be questioned and criticised when you made the decision to endorse but there is nothing wrong with that- that is the nature of politics, debate is healthy and should be encouraged its just a shame when it verges into personal attacks.

[Dick]

I was going to comment earlier but the thread was closed to be split etc and so i saved my comment,i went out planning to post it when i returned only now it doesnt make sense any more and other people have said what i was going to and parts will now be off topic...so heres the edited version... (and as i was editing the thread was cleaned again so god only knows how this will turn out)

Im not too sure what im commenting on here? Is it meat saying we're haters? or that we're haters because of his endorsement? Or that we're generally shit?

I dont post much, but as you can see i have been a member here since '03 and i do read most of what gets posted.

So I just want to say,

1. Nice to know that there is a new album on the way, i look forward to it and hope it will once again be balls to the walls meat. Rockin!

2. Politics is politics and full of opinions and we all know what opinions are like. As for mine, i know ~~~~~~ all of american politics, i do just know that i'm a tad gay so dont necessarily agree with some of the candidates opinions and views. The fact Meat agrees with him for what he feels is the greater good of his country then fair play. As wonderful a dream it is to all be friends, sometimes we'll just disagree.

3. Meat, I think you shouldn't jump to saying we're all haters like you do as i know from what i read every day that there is a lot of respect and admiration for you. I can see how you can get wound up easily, ur an emotional creative type, I know I've Pm'd you many a time with various questions about the nature of performance and you have only ever been generous and gracious with your responses.
Then every so often you are calling out and shouting at people who love and respect you. Obviously the voice thread may have struck a nerve, you are a perfectionist and are always trying to maintain a specific quality, and we as fans and individuals are all allowed our own view and opinion of how we perceive perfection.
For some it was a certain era of your career, a certain album, a specific show and for others its simply just watching you work. People just want you to be the best, you wanted people to understand why you went for Romney, because you think hes the best for what your country needs. We as fans can feel that too, like football fans we want our team to be the best.
After all im sure you arent the only actor or singer on this board, im sure you inspired many here. And everyone wants to put their tuppence worth in, in most case because i believe they think they can help, even if you didnt ask for it. I'd love to know that something i did or said may have helped.

So i reckon you just need to take everything with a pinch of salt, ok there may be some posts from time to time stirring the pot but you're well able to deal with that. Yea, you dont want to on a site with your name on it, but that is part of the game it seems.

Seems like ive done the usual stoner thing of drifting and rambling.

Any questions about explanations of what i meant can be put on a post card....


Lots and Lots of Love

Richard

[anotherday]

All Right....

MEAT:

I have been a true "lifelong" fan. I even raised my children on your music, and pretty much nothing else. Your movies have a permanent place in my VHS and DVD collection. And you have touched my life in ways I cannot even begin to describe.

Your choice of endorsement, while not one that I AGREE with...believe has NO bearing on your music, nor your movies, nor my constant admiration for you. Simply put: I LOVE YOU. I will continue to support you until the day you quit, AND BEYOND.

I cannot believe there are people who are saying you're a BIGOT and a MORON just because you voiced your OPINION! But don't take it TOO harshly...This is AMERICA...Look at what we did to the Dixie Chicks (Another group I admire) after they came out against GWB. We will ALWAYS love you. I for ONE will ALWAYS be here for YOU! you can "PM" me, call me, anything! I will talk to you until your EAR falls OFF! :D.

I cannot WAIT for your new ALBUM and TOUR! Please, please come back to the MIDWEST! I LOVED your show at Mystic Lake, and would LOVE to SEE you again...Maybe even MEET you /faints.

Godspeed, and go "crazy" on your new album! You are VERY BRAVE!

AD

[DJLeen]

Can't you see the people who say they love me, are hurting me !! I came to read some good things and all I got was the same as those Libs wrote me, you suck. I came to visit my friends , found out different.
M

That's not true Meat, I always say I love you and I mean that from the bottom of my heart...
I'm sorry I'm not much on mlukfc, when the UK tour starts I'll try to write as many revieuws as I can ! I'll try to attend as many shows as possible in the UK ! I'm happy I can see you again in april, I've been waiting such a long time it will be 13 months after I met you in London. I want you to know That I don't travel to a foreign country for every artist I like to listen to...You Meat, are an exception I will only travel so far only for you !! Last february I traveled all the way to London for you, I knew... I only could be with you for + - 2 minutes ? I could have waited till you tour again but I didn't, I had to see you ! So I took the trip from Belgium to London and I don't regret myself that I did ! :) That's what true fans do I guess ??? ;) I hope the cold, long winter will pass soon so I can see you again in april ! Love you ( I mean that !) Sorry I couldn't resist lol ;) ((hugs)) XO

[BostonAngel]

Well I guess I saw it wrong too. Because you deleted them EVENTUALLY. But not initially. In fact (and I wish I had made caps) you even replied to one guy, whoms post was deleted already, and called him a moron. I know you deleted two of my posts but kept the pro-Romney replies up for at least 4 days after my posts were gone (perhaps longer but I didn't check in after those days. They are all gone now though

I have to say that you are not completely truthful here

Thank you Adje for supporting what I had noticed myself. Yes, first it was just the Obama posts that were deleted almost immediately. The pro Romney stuff stayed. Then it was ANYTHING political for either side that was deleted. Then, yesterday, Meat started playing THE WORD GAME - posting the definition of words that people had used against him. Of course that would only serve to get people going again, especially if it was one of your own words Most of those posts from yesterday were deleted, except for the few pro Romney ones. Then the debate continues here after he insults the fans. LOL. Yes, I am amused by it all actually. I am still looking forward to hearing the new album!

[carole]

I agree most don't deserve it , but I had to start the fight to find the real enemies. When it ends the real fans will still be here and I will do something special for them . Was thinking when I came on that was going to invite all here to a dress Rehearsal in April. I would say 97% will be invited.
Meat

Wow Meat, that would be a dream come true. If I can find a way, I will be there!!!!!

Carole

[ricgough]

I too am a lifelong fan, I believe personal politics has no bearing on ability as a performer and will judge based on the artistic output and basic humanity of a person or group rather than political affiliation. However, many fans, and I am one of them do not agree with Romney's (or more widely the current incarnation of Republican political ideology) - and in some (not necessarily all) areas find specific aspects of that abhorrent. (For the record I would cast myself as a centrist libertarian with no particular natural affiliation - for example I would look to history and proven, academically based economic theory for a solution for deficit reduction and economic growth (see John Keynes, IMF) before a right-wing, gaffe prone politician with overriding ideological, partisan and lobbyist agenda's anyday!). Where is the modern-day F.D. Rooseveldt when you need him!

When a culturally relevant recording artist puts his head above the parapet publicly then there is always going to agreement or disagreement on this amongst fans, the press and general populous. That should surely be part of the risk assesment for any business or cultural entity (and Meat, you are one of those too!) before any endorsement takes place. As an economic liberal who believes in a free market then the onus is upon that particular organisation, rather than the paying customer to provide an appropriate service and not alienate it's market base. You are in a cultural industry and that makes such political considerations relevant to your public standing, overall popularity and ultimately economic success or failure. We are discussing this in critical terms because I think we all wish you success. I certainly do. Unless you had strong market research suggesting a strong republican leaning, or had built a career based on conducive political artistic content (e.g. Dylan, Springsteen etc...) then there was always going to be a political risk to this endorsement.

I have close friends who vote very differently from me (in some cases diametrically so!) and frankly, I see the strength of a relationship in that we can row over it and agree to disagree,with personal bonds being unshaken as a result of the debate. This is where many on here have got it wrong over the last few days in my opinion.

I also may have my own opinions on artistic output which may of not be comfortable reading, but before I can hate or dislike something I have to either love or at least like it first and foremost. I don't have feelings for things I have no emotional connection to. This is often take as read by members posting due to the fact they actually spend their time in honour of a man and his music. This is not always tangible in specific posts. There is tacit approval of you and your career, your artistic output and personal likeability in the fact they are here in the first place and care enough to have an opinion first and foremost.

I feel there is mitigation on behalf of most posters here, but also Meat who obviously cares deeply about his fans and works incredibly hard to satisfy their demands.

I just wish all would simply read what they propose to say, re-read it and if they are still willing to post after consideration of others then so be it. That said, I think if that were always the case, most of the inflammatory stuff found on the web would not be posted, and the world would be a better place. That is down to personal responsibility on all sides.

I have loved Meat down the years and always will, but equally have enjoyed some performances more than others and feel some albums have greater longevity than others. On balance I love more than I hate and I believe that must be the the case for 97% of those here, even if I and others can sometimes be critical over specific points at times.

I hope I am regarded as a friend rather than an enemy, but will speak my mind if I feel the need to do so. That is all of me.

Take it or leave it as is your right.

[Evil Ernie]

Wow.

This... is the only thing I hate about ML. Love his music, don't care much about his politics. Here is on an internet forum typing things that I would expect from a 14 year old girl.

Pretty hard to not say that ML is a very immature 65 year old.

Oh, and for the record I don't hate him. But if he keeps this bullshit you may force me to start looking at his music differently.

[CarylB]

Hypocrite isn't the same as homophob.

Just saw this. Never suggested they were the same. My English is pretty good ;) I simply referred to the word being used to suggest Meat's actions and words over the years were false because he had endorsed Romney

Caryl

[wolfy35]

Some of the comments posted here over the last few days provide reason enough why I do not post here more often.

Meat is entitled to his own opinions, beliefs and alliances & people here should respect that irrespective of their own. There can be no excuse for some of the personal attacks I have read here over the last few days & I hope that the people who have made them hang their heads in shame.

So what if Meat has an off day vocally, it happens, Meat has never tried to say he is perfect far from it often he will beat himself up considering a performance below his best when everyone else says it was amazing.

I am not American nor do I have more of an understanding of the Obama/Romney election any more in depth than it is covered on UK news programs but does that really matter? Meat is American and he has chosen to make his feelings known by publicly supporting one of the candidates. That is not only his own personal choice but his right under the freedom that we all enjoy, something that we should all feel grateful that we have because there are many countries around the world where people are told what their choices are and if they disagree they are reminded at gunpoint.

I have been a Meat Loaf fan since I was given a copy of BOOH at 7 years old & I will remain a fan for as long as I live. Meat has given me more joy and hope through his music than I can ever find words to explain & he has asked nothing in return, Instead I choose to stay loyal and I am proud to say that I always will.

[The Flying Mouse]

:twisted: Downloading music discussion moved here (http://www.mlukfc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18625)

Sorry to be a bit on top of things folks, but that's an issue that I know will spark big discussion, and this thread has plenty already :wink:

[Mr. Happy]

:twisted: OK, last chance saloon for this thread.

The subject is Meat's post here aimed at his critics concerning the voice thread and his endorcement.

Could not care less about the endorsement. Who Meat supports is his own decision.

To call 97% of the people here haters for posts like those in the voice thread is pathetic. I was expecting that thread to be a nightmare when it first started, but it turned out very respectful and thoughtful. How can you possibly get offended at something like that?

Aaaaaaand that's my contribution to this pile of :shit:

EDIT: No, actually, one more thing. This is really an amazing way to spread excitement about the fact you have a new album coming out and make people want to buy it. Really, it is.

[Evil Ernie]

97% of you can go to hell , don't buy my CD, don't buy tickets ... stay away from me .
You come to a meet and greet I will have you removed from the room and the building with your money back !!


Hey, I just thought of something.

If you wanted to meet ML but couldn't afford it you could just buy a M&G pass, meet ML, tell him that you saw his post on mlukfc, that you ARE one of the 97% and have them escort you out with your money back.

http://cache.ohinternet.com/images/thumb/2/2d/Trollface_HD.png/618px-Trollface_HD.png

A ridiculous statement deserves to be mocked as such.

[Evil Ernie]

Could not care less about the endorsement. Who Meat supports is his own decision.

To call 97% of the people here haters for posts like those in the voice thread is pathetic. I was expecting that thread to be a nightmare when it first started, but it turned out very respectful and thoughtful. How can you possibly get offended at something like that?

Aaaaaaand that's my contribution to this pile of :shit:

I see that thread got deleted.

It's amazing how an insightful thread gets deleted yet THIS thread, with ML creating posts with sweeping, leaping judgements remains.

[Sarge]

It's amazing how an insightful thread gets deleted yet THIS thread, with ML creating posts with sweeping, leaping judgements remains.

Because music doesn't seem to matter anymore. You're obviously regarded as an "enemy" if you dare to discuss anything related to Meat Loaf's work in depth. Making mischief among people who actually should share a common interest seems to have become some people's main objective instead.

[BostonAngel]

Hey, I just thought of something.

If you wanted to meet ML but couldn't afford it you could just buy a M&G pass, meet ML, tell him that you saw his post on mlukfc, that you ARE one of the 97% and have them escort you out with your money back......

A ridiculous statement deserves to be mocked as such.

now you just ruined my plan to get a free M&G for the next tour! LOL

[Evil Ernie]

Because music doesn't seem to matter anymore. You're obviously regarded as an "enemy" if you dare to discuss anything related to Meat Loaf's work in depth. Making mischief among people who actually should share a common interest seems to have become some people's main objective instead.

That's why I generally don't want to know too much about an artist. It may sound cheesy, but they should try to be larger than life. They should try to be mysterious. They may make some opinions known, but the cool ones make any comments that they make insightful and they leave the audience wanting more. And nothing as lame as politics. I'm not saying ML isn't cool overall, but endorsing MR takes him down a peg on the 'coolness' factor because MR is about as Lame and disconnected from the general public as you can get.

That's why I like an artist like Axl Rose or Prince. They may both be batshit crazy, but when they speak or make an appearance people take notice because they're so elusive and hard to get ahold of.

The best ones know that the office of POTUS is just a charade that the American public goes through every 4 years and there is very likely to be any change unless something MAJOR happens. Bill Hicks sums it up nicely here:

nXpdJLJqG9U

[Paul Richardson]

To call 97% of the people here haters for posts like those in the voice thread is pathetic.

... and hypocritical, no one here has come close to the rudeness, disrespect and hatefulness ML has displayed to the '97%'. Anyone else posting like this would have been deleted, infracted and banned.

I do understand because its ML, and because this site is dedicated to him, that special allowances are made ... but are there any other examples of an artist alienating their fan base in such a way ?

To then pass this off as some kind of ruse to expose his 'enemies' is equally pathetic. The general out pouring of 'love' on this site in relation to the new album and tour suggest that there are no 'enemies', only the ones that exist in ML's head.

I really wish ML did not post here, as his presence stops any kind of sensible debate about his music, career or politics. Its like treading on egg shells unless you're posting unquestioning adoration. If people want to interact with him why can't they do it on Facebook ?

It would be better for ML as at least he can retain editorial control where here, because he can only 'influence' it, this site only appears enrage him (... and all too frequently ...)

Sad. :roll:

[Gez]

Not long back from America. My relatives in CA think nothing has changed with Obama so maybe a new President isn't a bad thing......I'll sit with popcorn on Tues/Wed with HIAHB blasting out and a wee beer of course :)

[White of High]

Can't you see the people who say they love me, are hurting me !! I came to read some good things and all I got was the same as those Libs wrote me, you suck. I came to visit my friends , found out different.
M

As I told you: don't be on any side and nobody will find you! If you are a marketing face of a party don't be frustrated if they found you...

[nozza]

hi meat i dont say much but luv ya please can i come to your dress rehearsal please please please xxx (anne)

[nikox1]

Or just let him support who he wants? How he wants? next year sounds like it's gonna be great in the land of the loaf!! Lots of treats for us fans. Who cares what religion, race, or president wannabe people choose to back? I'm sure meat knows how the media works, I'm sure he knows the pitfalls all too well by now. And I'm sure he knows when he said or has done the wrong thing. I have family and friends in America, I respect the country and it's people. But to me the whole president thingy is one big circus!! A drama fueled sideshow!!! including my country, all government officials etc etc,, are liars and bullshitters!!! So to see the stupid reaction meat received on Facebook was the funniest thing I've ever seen. I like blue, you like green, I have a big nose and you have a big ass etc etc,,, life goes on people

[AndrewG]

I really wish ML did not post here, as his presence stops any kind of sensible debate about his music, career or politics. Its like treading on egg shells unless you're posting unquestioning adoration. If people want to interact with him why can't they do it on Facebook ?

It would be better for ML as at least he can retain editorial control where here, because he can only 'influence' it, this site only appears enrage him (... and all too frequently ...)

Sad. :roll:

Indeed. I really thought yesterday it might be best if his account was banned, maybe temporarily. I know that sounds crazy but I really feel some of the moderators let this place down at times. They make it seem like common visitors are idiots and should play by the rules precisely or shut the ~~~~ up or just remove entire threads which had 99% great respectful posts. And then the artist himself can insult anyone all he likes. It gives a dangerous sense of censorship to the point people cannot feel comfortable speaking freely.

Calling people "evil" is NOT cool!

I do sense some regret in some of Meat's later posts here (thank goodness!) and I am sure he doesn't really hate people on here but it still sad a few lifelong fans have now left.

Yesterday should have been a day of celebration instead it was one of the most disappointing days to be a fan since I followed Meat since 1993. And with follow, I mean follow him musically. I do not mind who he votes for AT ALL or what he gets up to in his private life (as long as he follows some basic morals and principles which I think he always has anyway).

Despite all this I still respect the man tremendously for his hard work and craftsmanship and will always be eternally grateful for all the inspiration in music and life.

[djfierce]

Personal opinion: When you as a celebrity stand up and endorse a candidate, i don't care which side or which country, you put yourself out there to be questioned on it and criticized by those that don't agree. That's the downside of standing on a stage or platform rather than talking amongst your friends at home. When you stand up publicly, you are deemed to be using your public standing and popularity to put weight behind that candidate, so in my book, you don't get to say it's just my opinion or you can't criticize me, or jump off the deep end when your morals are called into question. When you stand up like that you are deemed to be endorsing that candidate in all they stand for, my interpretation of electing a leader maybe wrong but i always assumed that you don't get to pick and choose which parts of the candidates beliefs, morals and ambitions make it into the big house (whichever country)

[Sue K]

I think I'm on topic when I say ... this is all just so sad ... :( ...

If my husband has a different opinion than I do regarding politics ... should I divorce him ? ... Hate him ? ... He could feel one way 25 years ago when we met ... and feel differently now... as I could as well ...

Good luck to the United States Of America... the land I love... tomorrow ...

And to quote Rodney King ... Can't We All Just Get Along ? ...

Peace ...

Sue ... xo

[AndrewG]

If my husband has a different opinion than I do regarding politics ... should I divorce him ? ... Hate him ? ... He could feel one way 25 years ago when we met ... and feel differently now... as I could as well ...


A difference of opinion on politics is one thing, a difference of what you think of each other could indeed well lead to divorce. :-(

[chairboys]

Hello everyone!
Once again, I have returned from a family break to what resembles the proverbial "bombsite".
I am armed and ready with my broom to help clear up the debris. Just give me the nod when.
The news about the new album and tour is terrific. Meat has dangled another juicy carrot for us to devour. He has thrown so many of those orange vegetables over the years that I can see perfectly in the dark.
A dress rehearsal gig? Wow. As this is my 1000th post, does that guarantee me entry? ;)

PS Has the 97% been rounded up to a whole number from 96.7%?

[Sarge]

... and hypocritical, no one here has come close to the rudeness, disrespect and hatefulness ML has displayed to the '97%'. Anyone else posting like this would have been deleted, infracted and banned.

Exactly.

Edit: Removed the original long post. I realized that it's useless to further elaborate on the sad matter. It has reached a point at which I don't care anymore. I'm tired of the games that are played on this forum. My time is too precious and I'm too old for this shit.

I remember the days when Meat Loaf's posts were informative and witty but unfortunately those days are obviously long gone. Today most of his comments are rather miffed and sometimes even downright hostile. I used to think that he was a smart person with integrity but his behavior on this forum has drastically changed the image I had of him. Very disappointing.

[Renegade Angel]

It has all been kicking off here! Im not a big poster on here these days but I still like to see whats happening. I have been a fan of meats since about 1982, my first gig was a ML show in 1988 when I was 11 years old, I have been to many of his shows over the years and Meat's music has made me the music fan I am today so when I saw that Meat was touring the UK I was really excitted at the thought of getting to see him for what might be the final time.

I came on here today to see what the buzz would be about the tour and the shows but all I see is a war zone! I thought this was a fan club site? shouldn't we the fans be happy about a tour that promises to be really special?

Come on people, lets get behind Meat and the band and look forward to what should be a great and last tour.
Im not kissing his arse here, im the first to say that on some occasions his voice has been off or theres some songs I don't like but at the end of the day i still enjoy the majority of his work and I will be there at one of the shows hopefully Sheffield?

Let's stay positive!!!

[Mr. Happy]

I came on here today to see what the buzz would be about the tour and the shows but all I see is a war zone! I thought this was a fan club site? shouldn't we the fans be happy about a tour that promises to be really special?

We should be...but to be fair, it was Meat Loaf himself that created the war zone question :shock:

His behavior on this forum has drastically changed the image I had of him. Very disappointing.

This is also true. I'd like to think of my idol as being the witty, likeable guy from the Storytellers DVD, not what's exemplified by the opening post of this thread. Oh well :shrug:

Go to Bruce Springsteen's site and kiss his ass !

Is there a Springsteen forum I can join? I might have to consider it.

[AndrewG]

It has all been kicking off here!


What exactly has been kicking off here? The only person who has done any form of kicking is Meat Loaf himself. Everyone else as far as I can see has posted in a respectful and dignified manner. Any editing or post removal moderators have had to do was with regards to off topic or political opinions, hardly "kicking off".


I came on here today to see what the buzz would be about the tour and the shows but all I see is a war zone! I thought this was a fan club site? shouldn't we the fans be happy about a tour that promises to be really special?

I also came to the site yesterday to hopefully start an interesting debate about the tour and album yet this was marred by Meat's reaction to the voice thread which then transgressed into the album thread which then got split into this "debate" thread by a moderator.


Come on people, lets get behind Meat and the band and look forward to what should be a great and last tour.

How can one seriously get behind someone after that person says 97% of you can go to hell and you are all evil?!


Im not kissing his arse here, im the first to say that on some occasions his voice has been off or theres some songs I don't like but at the end of the day i still enjoy the majority of his work and I will be there at one of the shows hopefully Sheffield?

Let's stay positive!!!
I hope you are positively in the 3% group.

[Renegade Angel]

When I say it's been kicking off, I meant as in 'it's all happening' which is unusual for this site as it seems pretty dead most of the time.

I think Meat knows deep down that his fans don't 'hate' him. I couldn't care less if he thinks im in 3% or 97% of the people on here, I know what type of fan I am. I have bought tickets, albums, dvds, t-shirts over the years and enjoyed everything I have got. There has been times when I think some songs have been terrible (I can't stand CHSIB) or his voice on certain shows have been poor but I wouldn't come on here to voice my opinion on it. I'd keep that to myself and try to discuss the bits I do like which is loads of things that Meat has done over the years.

[robgomm]

When I say it's been kicking off, I meant as in 'it's all happening' which is unusual for this site as it seems pretty dead most of the time.

I think Meat knows deep down that his fans don't 'hate' him. I couldn't care less if he thinks im in 3% or 97% of the people on here, I know what type of fan I am. I have bought tickets, albums, dvds, t-shirts over the years and enjoyed everything I have got. There has been times when I think some songs have been terrible (I can't stand CHSIB) or his voice on certain shows have been poor but I wouldn't come on here to voice my opinion on it. I'd keep that to myself and try to discuss the bits I do like which is loads of things that Meat has done over the years.

Rest assured Meat doesn't believe 97% hate him. It was a ploy to find out who the truly negative people are on the site. he has already explained but take note of the people that keep sticking to that 97% quote, they are either stupid in that they don't believe Meats explanation, or they are the people Meat has been talking about and are grabbing the chance to bash him as he knew they would. Fact is Meat has explained he didn't really mean 97%, to keep quoting that is just plain stupid and has shown Meat the people he was looking for. In short, his plan has worked very well.

[Sarge]

Rest assured Meat doesn't believe 97% hate him.

Why does he say so then? There is NO excuse and NO justification to insult people who haven't done anything to you. A fan forum should NOT be abused for one's "ploys". It's shocking that there are people who defend actions that disrupt the community. Nice way to find out if people like you. Would you insult all your friends or your entire family in order to find out who might be an "enemy"? That would be pretty crazy, don't you think? And guess how many friends you'd still have after that and how many members of your family would still like you.

[Adje]

they are either stupid in that they don't believe Meats explanation, or they are the people Meat has been talking about and are grabbing the chance to bash him as he knew they would.

It's not the smartest thing to blindly trust one person and call others, who disagree, stupid or hatred. No matter who that person is. ;)

[AndrewG]

In short, his plan has worked very well.

:down:

[evil nickname]

I find it uncanny how many people claim to know just what Meat *really* thinks or believes, and how that always proves the point they're making.

[Sarge]

It was a ploy to find out who the truly negative people are on the site.

Are you serious? The people who just left surely weren't "truly negative people". It takes a lot to put off those who have supported you for many years. Yes, this is really something to be proud of - not many artists accomplish that. Then again, I guess there are not that many artists who are eager to do that. Who could be seriously interested in getting rid of their own fans, especially of those who have deeply admired and spent a small fortune on you? Meat Loaf is unnecessarily shooting himself in the foot by randomly declaring people to be "enemies", in my opinion.

[GDW]

3 out of 100 ain't bad + 97 out of 100 are bad = MLUKFC. This is getting technical.:-)

[Wario]

Are you serious? The people who just left surely weren't "truly negative people". It takes a lot to put off those who have supported you for many years. Yes, this is really something to be proud of - not many artists accomplish that. Then again, I guess there are not that many artists who are eager to do that. Who could be seriously interested in getting rid of their own fans, especially of those who have deeply admired and spent a small fortune on you? Meat Loaf is unnecessarily shooting himself in the foot by randomly declaring people to be "enemies", in my opinion.

hate to say it but meat has a Huge fanbase that exceeds this site. losing a few longtime fans on here wont effect anything. Im very sad to see them leave, but the big picture is meats fanbase is huge and their loss isnt that unfortunate to a technical view. Personally, im sad to see allrevvedup go and see someone say (I forget who and not in these precise words) "i respect the music not the man". Meat did an experiment and while I dont think anyone was his "enemy", it showed just how on-the-line of not being fans some people were. To leave just for this reason is ridiculous in my view. I could never legitimately leave this place, its like a second home no matter what happens. This thread is full of just as much positive energy as negative and maybe even more positive then negative. If he said stuff to your face ok, but but this is the internet. lets all grow some bat balls. This is one of the best threads ever to hit MLUKFC. Our army is still strong even if we lose a few men in the process.

again I cant stress how sad it is we lost a few fans, but its not like itll have any effect on the fanbase as a whole. so nothing that happened here is that big of a deal.

Meat loves us no matter what. This site may get on his nerves sometimes, but he always comes back regardless. he may not admit it, but I think he thinks this place is like his third family (his second family being the band)

[robgomm]

Would you insult all your friends or your entire family in order to find out who might be an "enemy"? That would be pretty crazy, don't you think? And guess how many friends you'd still have after that and how many members of your family would still like you.

Lol that's totally irrelavent and completely different. You know what I can't be bothered to explain it to you guys if you don't get it, i'm done posting in this thread.

[robgomm]

:down:

:down:

[chairboys]

Our army is still strong even if we lose a few men in the process.



:lol::lol::lol: Yes General Wario!

[evil nickname]

lets all grow some bat balls

Ehm, no? And while we're at it, yuck.

[misterfive]

This is ridiculous lets face facts it doesn't change whether you vote for the Mormon or the Black guy, do you really think the way they would've run the country differ? Honestly if Obama was the president instead of Bush Iraq would still have been invaded. It doesn't change just cause you got a different face in office.

Just let anyone have their preference its all just another butcher in the land of the pigs anyhow so why get so into this when we have more important things to discuss... like Brave and Crazy!

[AndrewG]

hate to say it but meat has a Huge fanbase that exceeds this site. losing a few longtime fans on here wont effect anything. Im very sad to see them leave, but the big picture is meats fanbase is huge and their loss isnt that unfortunate to a technical view.

This still is no reason to insult everyone here. I agree Meat's "fanbase" is larger than what is displayed here. However when it comes to his UK travelling fanbase I'm not so sure. He can play any arena and people in that city will be there I agree but the the people in the first 2-3 rows are often the same ones. Also whenever I go to Meet and Greets it's always the same ones there in the UK and many of who are regular posters here or have at least visited here. It's a bit hypocritical to suggest those shouldn't come to M&Gs anymore as they have collectively given Meat a nice little cash bonus at each show just to have the honour of meeting him.

And as for those who say this was an experiment I don't buy that at all. I just read that as a regret without apologising properly.

[LuuuuvMeat]

Rest assured Meat doesn't believe 97% hate him. It was a ploy to find out who the truly negative people are on the site. he has already explained but take note of the people that keep sticking to that 97% quote, they are either stupid in that they don't believe Meats explanation, or they are the people Meat has been talking about and are grabbing the chance to bash him as he knew they would. Fact is Meat has explained he didn't really mean 97%, to keep quoting that is just plain stupid and has shown Meat the people he was looking for. In short, his plan has worked very well.




LOL!

[Gez]

I find it uncanny how many people claim to know just what Meat *really* thinks or believes, and how that always proves the point they're making.

Rubbish. No-one sucking up to Meat but we are entitled to OUR opinion, democracy and a beer (potential song there) :D

[JaysScout]

This still is no reason to insult everyone here. I agree Meat's "fanbase" is larger than what is displayed here. However when it comes to his UK travelling fanbase I'm not so sure. He can play any arena and people in that city will be there I agree but the the people in the first 2-3 rows are often the same ones. Also whenever I go to Meet and Greets it's always the same ones there in the UK and many of who are regular posters here or have at least visited here. It's a bit hypocritical to suggest those shouldn't come to M&Gs anymore as they have collectively given Meat a nice little cash bonus at each show just to have the honour of meeting him.

And as for those who say this was an experiment I don't buy that at all. I just read that as a regret without apologising properly.

I hardly think that Meat needs the "nice little cash bonus", nor does he do the M&Gs for that reason.

[CarylB]

I agree Meat's "fanbase" is larger than what is displayed here. However when it comes to his UK travelling fanbase I'm not so sure. He can play any arena and people in that city will be there I agree but the the people in the first 2-3 rows are often the same ones.

Much larger. And some of those in the first 2-3 rows of shows you have attended may be the same .. and some of us will still be there. Any others will imo be gratefully taken up by some of the other 10,000.

Also whenever I go to Meet and Greets it's always the same ones there in the UK and many of who are regular posters here or have at least visited here.

Really? That's not my experience. Yes, there will be some faces who attend, but many (in fact I'd say more) quite unfamiliar ones, and not regular posters here.

.... as they have collectively given Meat a nice little cash bonus at each show just to have the honour of meeting him.

A rather large (and imo a rather snarky) assumption, unless you are privy to the figures and budgets, which to be honest I doubt. I don't think you have any better idea than any of us as to how much the promoter takes, how much VIP Nation (or other organising body) takes, how much may be used as part of the over all budget, and how much, if anything, Meat receives specifically from the packages.

[Evil One]

Or just let him support who he wants? How he wants? next year sounds like it's gonna be great in the land of the loaf!! Lots of treats for us fans. Who cares what religion, race, or president wannabe people choose to back? I'm sure meat knows how the media works, I'm sure he knows the pitfalls all too well by now. And I'm sure he knows when he said or has done the wrong thing. I have family and friends in America, I respect the country and it's people. But to me the whole president thingy is one big circus!! A drama fueled sideshow!!! including my country, all government officials etc etc,, are liars and bullshitters!!! So to see the stupid reaction meat received on Facebook was the funniest thing I've ever seen. I like blue, you like green, I have a big nose and you have a big ass etc etc,,, life goes on people
I thought you left and made a big song and dance about never coming back. :roll:

[Sarge]

Wario, I know you're a big fan and I think that you are sincere. I understand why you'd defend and justify anything Meat Loaf does or says, even if it's plain wrong. However, I disagree with you.

You think Meat Loaf "loves" us? He has a weird way of showing that "love". He always comes back to this site? Yeah, to tell us what horrible people we are. :roll: The loss of some of the most devoted fans does not matter? People being hurt, disappointed and wrongfully insulted is just a "technical" issue? To me, it does matter if people who have been part of this community for many years leave. It's mostly due to some of the members of this forum why I'm still here and why I reconsidered my decision to ditch this place and the whole Meat Loaf thing twice.

I think that people and what they have contributed over the years are more important than sheer numbers. The way in which those people were treated was disgraceful, especially in one particular post by Meat Loaf that had to be deleted because it violated forum rules. The person it was targeted at hadn't even participated in any of the discussions Meat Loaf felt offended by. Given his choice of words, he seems to take pleasure in putting people off and seeing them leave. This is how much he "loves" us and how much "respect" he has for this fan club.

You can try to whitewash Meat Loaf's behavior as much as you like, you won't change my opinion. The only person who could change it is Meat Loaf himself but he hasn't taken the chance to do so.

[LucyK!]

Really? That's not my experience. Yes, there will be some faces who attend, but many (in fact I'd say more) quite unfamiliar ones, and not regular posters here.


Same here. I'm always guilty of turning up to M&Gs and expecting to know everyone (or at least know of them) and I'm always pleasantly surprised when there's complete strangers there - reminds me that actually the fanbase is much bigger than the MLUKFC in my head! And that goes for M&Gs from here, .net and paid ones of recent years.

[roomster]

I thought you left and made a big song and dance about never coming back. :roll:

Leaving and coming back seems to be a popular activity... ;)

[The Flying Mouse]

... and hypocritical, no one here has come close to the rudeness, disrespect and hatefulness ML has displayed to the '97%'. Anyone else posting like this would have been deleted, infracted and banned.


:twisted: And Meat has took a good bit of a bashing in return.
That's why I kept the edit to a minimum.

I remember hearing (true story) about the brother of a king who shot a monk for a laugh. The king pardoned his brother, but told him that he would likewise pardon anyone who decided to shoot his brother.

As far as i'm concerned, Meat shot his monk yesterday.
And if that doesn't scream "put me on a T shirt", I don't know what does :wtf: .

Every time Meat comes to us and speaks to us like that there's an outpouring of sympathy for him. It's not doing the trick is it?
I'll be sympathetic for him, as well as having sympathy myself and the rest of the fans who are treated so harshly.
One thing I can't feel is guilty, because I believe he is wrong in his general opinion of us.
I think Meat needs to know that his action, as well as being VERY hurtful, also piss off long time fans who are an asset to our community.

His post went unedited, and so did the replies.
I called an end to it after a while (you'll note my post was directed to everyone) but I couldn't very well edit everyones replies when they had been insulted so much.






Indeed. I really thought yesterday it might be best if his account was banned, maybe temporarily.

IMPO, that's not realistic.


I also came to the site yesterday to hopefully start an interesting debate about the tour and album yet this was marred by Meat's reaction to the voice thread which then transgressed into the album thread which then got split into this "debate" thread by a moderator.


The thread about the new album couldn't have been left as it was, could it? :shrug:



Rest assured Meat doesn't believe 97% hate him. It was a ploy to find out who the truly negative people are on the site.

If it was, I don't know why he felt it neccersary.


In short, his plan has worked very well.

I beg to differ.
NOTHING positive has come from this (apart from maybe an invite to a dress rehearsal, which would be pretty cool, but we'll see if that happens :shrug: )
As far as I can see it only achieved a lot of insult, upset, grief, and anger. Not to mention some long term fans getting so pissed off that our community had been so badly treated they no longer wish to be a part of our community. Including two of our forum staff.
Not to mention the fact I spent over 5 hours myself modding pretty much one thread. I can't even remember how many times I locked the thread, cleaned it, opened it, and then deleted more posts.
Believe me, it was not my idea of fun on a peaceful Sunday afternoon.

I can't say anything worked pretty well, least of all any kind of plan.

[Monstro]

hate to say it but meat has a Huge fanbase that exceeds this site. losing a few longtime fans on here wont effect anything.

Yes it will and it has, a couple of ticket/album sales lost may be insignificant as far as Meat's concerned but as far as I'm concerned a slap in the face from a man I've followed and admired for over 30yrs is significant and to then call it an experiment just adds insult to injury, I'd have been as impressed with an outright apology as I was at first insulted by his words.

Meat loves us no matter what.

Really? He's got a mightily weird way of showing it, never had anyone treat me like a lab rat to find out how I feel, personally I'd rather he just asked me instead of coming here and taking all the crap his facebook page got out on us.

Rest assured Meat doesn't believe 97% hate him. It was a ploy to find out who the truly negative people are on the site. he has already explained but take note of the people that keep sticking to that 97% quote, they are either stupid in that they don't believe Meats explanation, or they are the people Meat has been talking about and are grabbing the chance to bash him as he knew they would. Fact is Meat has explained he didn't really mean 97%, to keep quoting that is just plain stupid and has shown Meat the people he was looking for. In short, his plan has worked very well.

I have never "bashed" Meat but in fact have been a staunch supporter for many years, you can include me in whatever percentage or group you want but there's nothing you can say that can justify his behavior to loyal long term supporters of the man and his music. I don't believe his explanation that it was an experiment and neither am I stupid, nor am I appeased by some story about free tickets to a dress rehearsal, Meat should apologise to this fanbase not expect blind loyalty.

I really don't expect anyone to understand this bit but for the first time in 17yrs there's no picture of Meat in my office at work, took them down today.

[AndrewG]

A rather large (and imo a rather snarky) assumption, unless you are privy to the figures and budgets, which to be honest I doubt. I don't think you have any better idea than any of us as to how much the promoter takes, how much VIP Nation (or other organising body) takes, how much may be used as part of the over all budget, and how much, if anything, Meat receives specifically from the packages.

Not any more snarky than telling people to not come to M&Gs any more. Rest assured I won't and I hope you have fun Caryl.

[evil nickname]

Rubbish. No-one sucking up to Meat but we are entitled to OUR opinion, democracy and a beer (potential song there) :D

Fair enough. We're not going to agree on that, then, but that's allright with me.

[The Flying Mouse]

I'd have been as impressed with an outright apology as I was at first insulted by his words.


:twisted: I think many would :up:




I really don't expect anyone to understand this bit but for the first time in 17yrs there's no picture of Meat in my office at work, took them down today.

I'm very sorry to hear that :(
For such a long time supporter to do something like that isn't pretty much on a whim.
I'm sorry that you are angry and hurt enough to take his picture down. I hope they go back up sometime soon.

Meat has got two sides. The one that will think "you take my picture down? WELL F*CK YOU :bicker: " and the one that will realize he's f*cked up and hurt people who love and respect him very much. It's heads or tails which mood he'll be in next time, but I hope it's the latter.

[The Flying Mouse]

Hey person, can only be shipped on so much before they finally start fighting back, and I think that is what has happened in this situation

People treat him like crap, and then when he finally goes off they then decide to turn around and Act all innocent. And accuse others of the playing silly games and starting fights.

This situation has likely been a long time coming

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

:twisted: I disagree.
The voice thread was far more respectful than I expected. The politics, things were a little heated there at times, but nothing, NOTHING compaired anywhere near to what he was getting on Facebook.
I've already said once, if he had that type of personal insult and abuse here, it would have been deleted. We'd do the same for any member.
Fact!
The attack on the members here was completley unprovoked. You only have to see the hurt and angry reaction from some very long time fans to realise that.

It's not right for Meat to take the abuse he's had on facebook out on us.
Even Meat knows that with his sudden change of tone.

[nikox1]

Everybody can have a view on this and by all means vent an opinion. The only thing I find interesting about all this is it's taken this long? this day was always gonna happen IMO,,

[lorenzoduke]

I never bothered reading the voice thread, simply because I generally disagree with those kind of comments here and to me it's repetitive and pointless. Meat's always had off-days here and there and struggled at times, I remember seeing him once around 1996/7 when he clearly was running a fever and getting over a cold/flu. Everyone could see he was struggling but he went for it, gave it all, and absolutely everyone that I could see left amazed and satisfied by his commitment. I was at the Amsterdam show on the Bat 3 tour (and the one on the Casa De Carne tour) which Meat has said were his two worst gigs and I loved them both, I really didn't see or hear a problem.

At times it does get tiresome hearing people complain about one 3 minute clip here or there so I can only imagine how aggravating and upsetting it is for Meat. Likewise I don't click on threads dissing the recent albums, which I love, because they're always full of the same sort of posts from people who seem to think Meat shouldn't sing anything unless Steinman wrote it.

Having said all that, I thought the Romney thread here (the one that was locked) was for the most part respectful and one of the most interesting we've had in a while. Meat, no one was trying to dictate your beliefs to you and I don't recall anyone calling you names, telling you to go f yourself etc.

You chose to make a public stand and people had questions and speculations based on it, which you of course were free to answer or ignore as you see fit.. It's only natural that when you do something for the first time in your career, people are going to be blindsided by it. If you endorse someone people are going to wonder what points you're endorsing and what you oppose. It's human nature and has nothing whatsoever to do with being a fan or not being a fan. If we didn't care about you we wouldn't care enough to be asking 'Why does he think this?' and 'What does he mean by that'. I heard a lot of mean spirited crap and childish insults were said about you over the Romney thing on Facebook, but that's there and this is here.

I know you're an intelligent man with strong beliefs and convictions. Maybe I'm one of those dumb people that you see, but I don't understand why telling people to go to hell and go ~~~~ themselves has to go along with expressing that.

[mdoyle604]

Meat as a 19 year old fan I just want to start off with that I am a huge fan of your work and you are a true inspiration, to myself and a bunch of my friends back home. It kills me to see "your fans" and yourself get so heated up over you own political views. Your views have not changed the way I feel about your work or you as a person, and I thank you for standing up for yourself and your beliefs. Here are few stories on how you impacted me.

In 2011, you played in Big Flats NY. Me and my friends months in advance waited until midnight to but our tickets to grantee us first row. We got to the concert 5 hours early, in hope to meet you and the band. We saw your buses pull in and right away we meet Patti who signed our album. Then we asked security if you were in yet and they kept telling us you or the band had not arrived yet (we showed them Patti signature, and they still tried to fool us.) We then saw the whole band eating dinner and security let me and my friend go up to the door where we got to meet the whole band and get signatures before the show. The show kicked off, and me and my friends jaw hit the ground YOU BLEW US AWAY. (The night before we say Ted Nugent, and I will tell you this your show still stands as the best show I have ever seen, (Ted Nugent, Lindsey Buckingham,Creedence Clearwater REO Speedwagon and Johnny Winter). To being seeing you, front row just blew my mind. As you walked off stage me and my friend quickly ran over with our albums, and as you walked by us you pointed to me and my friend and security let us in. We did not get to meet you but you signed our albums which was the cherry on top of the best night of my life.

I have seen you three more time on the Mad Mad World Tour (Boston, Hershey and Mohegan Sun) In Boston I brought my cousin who only listen to rap and he turned to me at the end of your show and said "That was THE BEST CONCERT EVER!!!) We then jumped a 10ft barb-wired fence to get backstage just to have the chance to meet you. We then got caught by security who gave us a tour around and see the stage. The next day my cousin went out and bought Hang Cool Teddy bear and Hell In a Handbasket and loves them. At Hershey Me and my 4 best friends and my dad got to stand right up to the stage. As you gave it your all for 3 hours. You turned my dad into a fan after your performance.

Meat you are an inspiration and a perfectionist. Every show you walk on that stage and you give one of the best rock performances still out there. I love Hang Cool Teddy Bear, Hell in a Handbasket and can not wait for the new album. Don't stoop down to he negative comments, you are better then that. I CAN'T WAIT TO SEE WHAT YOU WILL BRING IN THE NEAR FUTURE KEEP ROCKING!!!!!!! I HOPE YOU READ THIS!!!!!!!

[BoyBehindBars]

Can't you see the people who say they love me, are hurting me !! I came to read some good things and all I got was the same as those Libs wrote me, you suck. I came to visit my friends , found out different.
M

Meat,
we critizise you if we don't like something, and we do if we love something. Critic is not necessarily negative. And why do we do that? Not because we want to hurt you. We do it because we care!
If you can't stand the fact someone doesn't like your latest record or disagree with your political views get yourself a punching ball but please don't use your fans as whipping boy.

To your earlier comment: I do not burn your records. Why should I? I still love most of them and I am proud of having discovered such an entertaining and gifted artist. I don't give a damn about your political views, your favourite dish (unless we had dinner together!), if you prefer Callaway over Hogan or Nike...But if you insult your fans, we react.

Don't be bitter, you have many loyal fans. We supported you, but we did not make you. We neither take you nor your music for granted, we never did. Be aware of it.

Please explain me why do I "suck"?

Keep on rocking, touring, acting. But please cut back your fan bashing.
Your fan, Tim.

[lorenzoduke]

Please explain me why do I "suck"?

Keep on rocking, touring, acting. But please cut back your fan bashing.
Your fan, Tim.

I read it as Meat saying that the 'Libs' said 'you suck' to him.

[R.]

Please explain me why do I "suck"?You don't, this isn't directed at you. Lies den Satz nochmal ... ;)

[misterfive]

So, we are Meat Loaf fans what do we care? We are the wasted youth, the kids with the bad attitude, we are going nowhere fast so deal with it, the fact we even bother dicussing it ruins the meaning of us being Meat Loaf fans.

[The Flying Mouse]

:twisted: Politcal in fighting deleted.

Again :facepalm:

[MarkS]

:twisted: Politcal in fighting deleted.

Again :facepalm:

Honest question, how can we have a thread titled debates, but when two people are having a reasonably friendly debate on the political issue you run and delete it. We were not calling each other names, or using bad language towards one another, we were simply having a heated discussion on the issue? Doesn't really make much sense to me

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[LucyK!]

Hold up, if the posts about the US politics have gone then I'm not 100% sure what the thread is about? I'm close to lost :?

(For the record I'm genuinely asking, not stirring!)

[The Flying Mouse]

Hold up, if the posts about the US politics have gone then I'm not 100% sure what the thread is about? I'm close to lost :?

(For the record I'm genuinely asking, not stirring!)

:twisted: The thread is about the issue of Meat's responce to the reaction to his endorcement, and the voice thread.

Arguing the pros and cons of the health bill among ourselves have got nothing to do with what Meat has said about his fans, and this forum.
It's a fan forum, not a political forum.

If folks want to debate politics, there are sites for that very purpose.
The mods on those sites are, I imagine, better informed of the facts and better qualified to handle that kind of debate.

Here it does nothing but muddy the water and give folks something else to argue over in what is already a very highly strung thread.

[ForeverInBat]

I simply cannot get past how easily Meat could turn on his own fans.

I idolised you Meat! I have never criticised you nor have I done anything for you to tar me with the same insults you directed at your fans on here. I have spent thousands of pounds to see and support you.

Well it ends today, I wouldnt speak to my dog the way you have spoken to us on here, regardless of what the circumstances are or were.

Im out!

[The Flying Mouse]

Honest question, how can we have a thread titled debates, but when two people are having a reasonably friendly debate on the political issue you run and delete it. We were not calling each other names, or using bad language towards one another, we were simply having a heated discussion on the issue? Doesn't really make much sense to me

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

:twisted: Honest answer? Because I didn't have a fecking clue what else to call it.
I had considered "Meat Vs MLUKFC" but it seemed a little on the nose. :bleh:

[LucyK!]

:twisted: The thread is about the issue of Meat's responce to the reaction to his endorcement, and the voice thread.

Arguing the pros and cons of the health bill among ourselves have got nothing to do with what Meat has said about his fans, and this forum.
It's a fan forum, not a political forum.
.

Ok...so, for the sake of being clear, are you saying that people are allowed to post frankly and honestly what they think about what Meat said about the fans? That is what this thread is about?

[amethyst]

Meat Loaf ~ I really don't care if you think i'm in the 97% or the 3% ~ but you know what ~ what you said and how you said it was wrong, plain and simple.

I was there in London when you couldn't carry on with the show, I ~ with others, waited for hours outside for any news about you. I've spent money (money I can ill afford at times) on CD's from other countries just so I can hear them before they come out in the UK, bought tickets, bought merchandise and supported your charity. I've queued for hours just to have a few moments with you signing a CD.

Would I change anything ~ hell no!

I'm not complaining about the money i've spent, the time i've spent ~ i'd do it all again in a heartbeat, but you know what, you really really hurt people with what you said.

I came on here to find out about the new album and the UK tour, instead I found this and, to be honest, it sucks.

I hope you do the honourable thing and apologise to the people here, it would be a terrible shame if more people left because of it.

xxxx

[The Flying Mouse]

Ok...so, for the sake of being clear, are you saying that people are allowed to post frankly and honestly what they think about what Meat said about the fans? That is what this thread is about?

:twisted: From what I can see, that's what the thread is about, and that's what people have been doing.

The only editing done to the thread has been removing any political debate over issues like the health bill.
As I say, we've got plenty on our plate without a political argument on top of things.

[LucyK!]

Well in which case, Meat - I think what you've said is sh!t.

I love you to bits, that won't stop and I'll still go on tour because frankly I'm in this until the bitter end now but what you've said here is horrid.

There are people here with debts up to their eyeballs, people who haven't finished paying off the last tour before they're trying to book tickets for the next one. You may think that we forget you as soon as a tour is finished but we don't - for many people here, supporting you is quite literally a full time job which impacts heavily on their every day lives.

We're all human, we all make mistakes, get things right and get things wrong, but you got this one wrong I'm sorry to say.

[The Flying Mouse]

You want balls? I'll give you balls my dear...



Well in which case, Meat - I think what you've said is sh!t.

I love you to bits, that won't stop and I'll still go on tour because frankly I'm in this until the bitter end now but what you've said here is horrid.

There are people here with debts up to their eyeballs, people who haven't finished paying off the last tour before they're trying to book tickets for the next one. You may think that we forget you as soon as a tour is finished but we don't - for many people here, supporting you is quite literally a full time job which impacts heavily on their every day lives.

We're all human, we all make mistakes, get things right and get things wrong, but you got this one wrong I'm sorry to say.

:twisted: Now THIS is balls :lawl:

Well said Lucy. :cool:

[robgomm]

:twisted: From what I can see, that's what the thread is about, and that's what people have been doing.

The only editing done to the thread has been removing any political debate over issues like the health bill.
As I say, we've got plenty on our plate without a political argument on top of things.

But some of us are interested in the US politics and how it differs from our own country, and Meat seemed willing to answer questions on it. I don't see a problem with that?

[The Flying Mouse]

But some of us are interested in the US politics and how it differs from our own country, and Meat seemed willing to answer questions on it. I don't see a problem with that?

:twisted: Cool, ask Meat questions.

As for a free for all political debate, there are places on the web for that very purpose.

I said OK to questions about specific points of policy, because it's relevant to the candidate that Meat has endorced (and the one he didn't), and why it's a big deal.
Answering those questions using quotes, OK, fair enough, but personal opinion about your political views, post it on facebook rather than get into fights here about it.

[MarkS]

:twisted: Honest answer? Because I didn't have a fecking clue what else to call it.
I had considered "Meat Vs MLUKFC" but it seemed a little on the nose. :bleh:

While I appreciate an honest answer, I feel like you would make your job much easier if there were a clear stance on what this thread was for.

Perhaps a simple title like "Meat and the fans"

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[robgomm]

Well in which case, Meat - I think what you've said is sh!t.

I love you to bits, that won't stop and I'll still go on tour because frankly I'm in this until the bitter end now but what you've said here is horrid.

There are people here with debts up to their eyeballs, people who haven't finished paying off the last tour before they're trying to book tickets for the next one. You may think that we forget you as soon as a tour is finished but we don't - for many people here, supporting you is quite literally a full time job which impacts heavily on their every day lives.

We're all human, we all make mistakes, get things right and get things wrong, but you got this one wrong I'm sorry to say.

Lucy, money is irrelavant, people make their choice to do all those things or not. He knows we don't forget him, he's not daft.

Can't you see that this is all a culmination of many years and years of Meat bashing here on this site by the same old few, and finally Meat has snapped and decided to do something about it?

To be honest, whoever was offended by the 97% sentence (which was a fake number anyway as explained) probably deserves to be in it, because if you know you're a good fan, and a respectful person who shows consideration for Meats feelings when posting, then your instant reaction is, well he doesn't mean me so i'm not offended. That was my reaction and that's why I have no problem with Meat standing up for himself.

[BostonAngel]

A difference of opinion on politics is one thing, a difference of what you think of each other could indeed well lead to divorce. :-(

EXACTLY! This isn't about a political opinion at all anymore. It is about bad, childish, uncalled for behaviour - from all sides! Some have tried to be respectful only to be insulted by the very artist whose music they adore. For any artist to insult almost its entire fan base is not cool. And if I were married to someone who continually insulted me & called me names, that would be considered verbal abuse and would be grounds for D-I-V-O-R-C-E!
Yes, I am now singing that country tune.

[Wario]

Meat please apologize. U can't lose Monstro or Neil or anyone else. Tell them u love em

[R.]

Jesus H Tapdancing Christ, can we stop the nitpicking for once?

It doesn't matter wether this thread's called "Debate" or "Marmite", because everyone involved knows what this is about. And if not, he or she will find out very easily by reading the 1st post. Just do as Neil requested and leave your political views out of the thread. Thank you.

And while you are thinking about a clever reply to this thread, I ask you to think about what may have caused the 1st post.

[The Flying Mouse]

I feel like you would make your job much easier if there were a clear stance on what this thread was for.


:twisted: Please, please, tell me you're joking :facepalm:




This is Meat responding to criticicm (real or perceived) over his endorcement of Mitt Romney, and to a lesser degree, the thread about his voice.

Yes, it's a rather political thread, but I think that in fighting over politics among ourselves does little else to muddy the water in a already (naurally) opinionated thread.

We can argue the larger points of politics all day, but I see this thread as a means for Meat to answer the concerns of his endorcement.
That's a big enough subject for us all.

If we want to debate general politics among ourselves there is off topic, or even better, forums elsewhere on the net devoted to the subject.

I think the best way to treat this thread is that Meat is on the podium, and we are asking him questions. It's where we have the right to ask him questions, and he has the right to reply.



:twisted: Again, can we try to keep to the more general subject of the thread rather than debate politics amongst ourselves?
The thread is quite hot as it is IMHO.
Not to mention how fast it's going. :panic:

To paraphare a f*cking great song, baby we can debate and argue all night, but that ain't getting us nowhere.


:twisted: Time for another clean up.
I was going to leave some of the polital debate posts up there, but people can't resist answering them.

Locked while i'm doing it.



The subject is Meat's post here aimed at his critics concerning the voice thread and his endorcement.

It's not a general political debate.
There are sites for that kind of debate.

I've left some of the vids up, and a quote from Obama, because they are answering questions concerning the candidates. This has got at least some relevance here because Meat has made an endorcement.

So questions about policy, and direct answers to those questions using quotes from the candidate as source material, fair enough, but quit the in fighting on politics please.



:twisted: Politcal in fighting deleted.

Again :facepalm:

:twisted: The thread is about the issue of Meat's responce to the reaction to his endorcement, and the voice thread.

Arguing the pros and cons of the health bill among ourselves have got nothing to do with what Meat has said about his fans, and this forum.
It's a fan forum, not a political forum.

If folks want to debate politics, there are sites for that very purpose.
The mods on those sites are, I imagine, better informed of the facts and better qualified to handle that kind of debate.

Here it does nothing but muddy the water and give folks something else to argue over in what is already a very highly strung thread.

:twisted: Cool, ask Meat questions.

As for a free for all political debate, there are places on the web for that very purpose.

I said OK to questions about specific points of policy, because it's relevant to the candidate that Meat has endorced (and the one he didn't), and why it's a big deal.
Answering those questions using quotes, OK, fair enough, but personal opinion about your political views, post it on facebook rather than get into fights here about it.

[jools35]

Well, i have not been active in these forums too much.
But i have followed then all the time.


I have read this thread in horror.

Each and everyone of us have views on politics-I bet i would disagree with a lot of people.
I might not like someones views or who they support, but i respect them for having views


Meats voice-

Even Meat has bad days-he has admitted it himself.

I was at the Cardiff gig with my housemate up in the upperdeck right at the back(my housemate is disabled)
Yes the sound was not great, but we had a great time.
I have seem meat 11 times live and would want to see him again- its going to be difficult due to money problems.
But as this his his last world tour, i would move heaven and earth to see him live once more.


MLUKFC - Meat Loaf United Kingdom Fan Club

Should be a place for fans to come and discuss Meat, the bank, and his music.

Yes there should be criticism allowed.
But from what i have seen way too much recently it HAS GOT TO PERSONAL

I love it that Meat takes take out to post on this forum
He does not have to.

Sorry for the long ramble, but things went to far on both sides.
Hopefully things will get better.


To Meat

Yes please for dress rehearsal tickets


Regards

Julian

[loaferman61]

Jesus H Tapdancing Christ
Whoa!!

[Tomjoad]

Very different tone in Meat posts here. Like they are written by different persons. There are moments when he is obviously angry and writes insulting posts. Moments when he is calm and writes the way he ever did. I think he came up with the dress rehearsal invitation when he realized he went too far. Anyway let's hope that thing doesn't remain on paper :lol:

[AndrewG]

Very different tone in Meat posts here. Like they are written by different persons.

Sometimes I indeed wondered if it was really Meat considering those outbursts. Every time I met him in person he seems completely different.

[renegadeangel]

To be honest it really doesn't matter, Damage is done. Can't undo what never should have happened.
No one should have criticized Meat for his political beliefs, that's very personal and for him to openly support anyone takes a lot of courage especially someone from the entertainment industry. You want to debate his choice, fine PM him and he can answer you if he chooses.
The thread about his voice, poor taste again. How many times do we have to go through that? For the record, I think that every album he has released has been vocally great, in it's own distinctive way.
To go on about the differences, pointless.
If we really want to criticize and nitpick and micro analyze every last detail of everything he does, no doubt your going to get an explosion.
Everyone is human and subject to the same human emotions.
Cut the guy some slack, let him do what he does best
Entertain us

[AndrewG]

I think that every album he has released has been vocally great, in it's own distinctive way.

The studio vocals on his recent albums have been outstanding in my opinion. I didn't think the vocal thread would last long, but surprisingly it was Very positive actually but I guess it's maybe hard to hear most people think the best vocals are in the past. Sad it's gone though. :shrug:

[nikox1]

Lucy, money is irrelavant, people make their choice to do all those things or not. He knows we don't forget him, he's not daft.

Can't you see that this is all a culmination of many years and years of Meat bashing here on this site by the same old few, and finally Meat has snapped and decided to do something about it?

To be honest, whoever was offended by the 97% sentence (which was a fake number anyway as explained) probably deserves to be in it, because if you know you're a good fan, and a respectful person who shows consideration for Meats feelings when posting, then your instant reaction is, well he doesn't mean me so i'm not offended. That was my reaction and that's why I have no problem with Meat standing up for himself. Exactly!!! Well put,, my name is not 97%, so I took no offense to it. He got pissed and went a bit far perhaps!!

[BostonAngel]

Wow.

This... is the only thing I hate about ML. Love his music, don't care much about his politics. Here is on an internet forum typing things that I would expect from a 14 year old girl.

Pretty hard to not say that ML is a very immature 65 year old.

Oh, and for the record I don't hate him. But if he keeps this bullshit you may force me to start looking at his music differently.

I don't hate him either. I have always admired him. I do dislike some of his recent behavior. As you said it has been immature. at the very least. I will always love his music. It just speaks to my soul. That will never change. I will definitely be buying his next album.
AS far as going to a future live show, that will depend on his own behavior. As much as I love the music, I wouldn't feel right about supporting an artist who has in fact PERSONALLY insulted me! Don't forget there was an entire thread started by him specifically to respond to ME. Yes it was moved over to this thread. That makes this all very personal to me. I was singled out and PERSONALLY insulted by a very grown man who I had always admired and would expect better & more mature behavior from. I am not sure whether to laugh at the absurdity of it or cry because it hurt so much.
I did say some harsh things so I am a bit to blame. I was just expressing my feelings and even though I may have been harsh, I stand by the sentiment & truthfulness of what I said. As an artist who, by the very nature of his career, chose to live his life in the public eye, Meat should be better able & prepared to handle criticism from the public. Yes, he is human. Still to attack his fans and make it personal is unacceptable to me. Yes, it hurts
Obviously something I said, affected him on a deep level. If there was absolutely no truth to anything I said, I would think he would just ignore it and laugh it off. Usually people react like that when there is enough truth in what is being said to strike at the heart of the matter and touch a nerve.
Again, harsh or not, I do have "the balls" to stand by what I have said. You - both Meat and the rest of the fans - can agree or disagree with me. That is just how I feel.

[Moonlight shadow]

As Romney win I'm sick of laughing!

:twisted:

Let him go to hell politics. All those who want to talk politics that go to the Capitol.
Meat, you are a person built for many years, are very intelligent.
I join you in this effort to try to flush out these few characters who just want to destroy what you have earned during these 35 years.
I hope they let us enjoy both of us as your IT.

A big hug and know that will never abandon you "Cacho carne" (is how you are known in Spain):D

Beyond that, I was disappointed with adjectives

[BostonAngel]

Sometimes I indeed wondered if it was really Meat considering those outbursts. Every time I met him in person he seems completely different.

Don't forget the man is an actor as well. And I am not saying that when you meet him in person, he is completely acting. Just saying that in public, like at a M&G he is putting his best self forward; omething we all do. In that situation he is more apt to keep certain feelings in check & work very hard at presenting a very positive in control image.
We have seen this side of him - the emotional outburst - before a bit. Remember Celebrity Apprentice and Gary Busey? He realized his mistake in that situation, admitted it and apologized. Hopefully this will be the same. He will realize that insulting his fans and the way he has treated people is not good behavior. And that an apology is required.

[wizardofodd]

I think what people have to consider is this, joining a fan club site is different to a follow on twitter or a like on facebook, it is a personal thing. Many folks have been here for years and come regularly, its like a routine. that is dedicated fans for you! This is a place to discuss his work with fans- but what is amazing about it is the fact the man himself posts here too and for him to come onto the site and post such harsh things is simply shocking and damn right stupid. BUT for those like myself who are upset with his remarks that continue to stay here are a sign of how passionate we are and how much we love the mans work, but as a fan there would certainly only be so much I could take before I chose to leave and withdraw. Loosing dedicated fans should be a really big deal for Meat, no matter if he disagreed with their opinion on a particular matter- voice or politics.

From what I remember from the Romney endorsement thread people were simply discussing, debating the pros and cons of a public endorsement and their personal views concerning the candidate. There is nothing wrong with that, that is an interesting and healthy discussion that should have taken place. As far as the thread concerning Meats vocals I didn't see, I don't know what was said but all I know is from what I can remember seeing on other threads their was very minimal personal attacks especially in comparison to the facebook wall. Its been blown out of proportion and I hope Meat apologises for his remarks. 97% of his fans? Jesus that's worse than Romney disregarding the 47%- oh political point, is that allowed?

[AndrewG]

97% of his fans? Jesus that's worse than Romney disregarding the 47%- oh political point, is that allowed?

Clever. ;-)

[nikox1]

Don't forget the man is an actor as well. And I am not saying that when you meet him in person, he is completely acting. Just saying that in public, like at a M&G he is putting his best self forward; omething we all do. In that situation he is more apt to keep certain feelings in check & work very hard at presenting a very positive in control image.
We have seen this side of him - the emotional outburst - before a bit. Remember Celebrity Apprentice and Gary Busey? He realized his mistake in that situation, admitted it and apologized. Hopefully this will be the same. He will realize that insulting his fans and the way he has treated people is not good behavior. And that an apology is required.

I get that your hurting, but c,mon don't bring hes acting ability into it, you do not know meat on a personal level. I'm not saying what he posted was nice, but what some post about him is not very nice at the best of times. To be honest I think alot of people are playing the violin a little bit hard IMO. Again he should not of lashed out the way he did, but there are alot of devils with angel wings on here.

[BostonAngel]

I get that your hurting, but c,mon don't bring hes acting ability into it, you do not know meat on a personal level. I'm not saying what he posted was nice, but what some post about him is not very nice at the best of times. To be honest I think alot of people are playing the violin a little bit hard IMO. Again he should not of lashed out the way he did, but there are alot of devils with angel wings on here.

I meant it as at times we all put on a different face; if we are hurting sometimes we act as if all is fine; if we are mad we don't let it show & act as if nothing is bothering us; if we are sad we put on a happy face. It has nothing to do with knowing him personally. It is what we all do as human beings - put on an act. To a certain degree we are all an actor at sometime. Meat is just better at it, since he is in fact one by trade. I wasn't making a commentary on his acting ability really. If i was saying anything about his acting, I was being truly complimentary.
I think the post b4 the one you quoted made my feelings pretty clear. Yes, to a certain extent I am hurt. I was not lashing out at him in anyway with what I was saying in the post you quoted.

[Julie in the rv mirror]

If he said stuff to your face ok, but but this is the internet. lets all grow some bat balls.

If I were to look up the word "irony" in a dictionary, I think the definition would contain this post. (And I'm not referring to you, Wario)

again I cant stress how sad it is we lost a few fans, but its not like itll have any effect on the fanbase as a whole. so nothing that happened here is that big of a deal.

Not that big of a deal? I think it is to some fans who are clearly very hurt right now. I guess only some people's feelings are important around here. :roll:

I hardly think that Meat needs the "nice little cash bonus", nor does he do the M&Gs for that reason.

If he simply wanted to meet with fans he could do that without charging...just saying.

[suzieq]

If he simply wanted to meet with fans he could do that without charging...just saying.

But he couldn't give 30 prime tickets away for free now could he? M&G comes with a ticket too. This is a WIN for the fans. If he did M&G for free, then prime seats would likely go to legal scalpers (ebay/stub hub etc) and we'd have to pay upwards of $400 per seat anyway. Meat doesn't do M&G for the $....I think he's made it real clear that he isn't $ driven. But the M&G are a promoters package with the tickets.

[suzieq]

Don't forget the man is an actor as well. And I am not saying that when you meet him in person, he is completely acting. Just saying that in public, like at a M&G he is putting his best self forward; omething we all do. In that situation he is more apt to keep certain feelings in check & work very hard at presenting a very positive in control image.

I just don't buy what you are selling here. Seriously, the man is a professional and when he meets his fans at a M&G he is genuinely engaged. If he's had a bad day with the venue or travel or traffic or his soup was cold, it's all checked at the door before he meets his fans. He's appreciative of them coming (sometimes thousands of miles) and he makes fans feel special, as well as, in the moment. I always found him relaxed and in a great mental place for socializing.


We have seen this side of him - the emotional outburst - before a bit. Remember Celebrity Apprentice and Gary Busey? He realized his mistake in that situation, admitted it and apologized. Hopefully this will be the same. He will realize that insulting his fans and the way he has treated people is not good behavior. And that an apology is required.

It's his choice to apologize, but I see what Nikox1 sees. Devils with angelic wings....now playing a violin. 97% of the people will get the invite, 3% of those may be in the US unable to accept and of the remaining, maybe 50% will accept. If everyone is worried and fighting for their friends, why doesn't the friend try and get a message to Meat themselves? They have already made up their mind anyway haven't they? :shrug:

[Julie in the rv mirror]

But he couldn't give 30 prime tickets away for free now could he? M&G comes with a ticket too. This is a WIN for the fans. If he did M&G for free, then prime seats would likely go to legal scalpers (ebay/stub hub etc) and we'd have to pay upwards of $400 per seat anyway. Meat doesn't do M&G for the $....I think he's made it real clear that he isn't $ driven. But the M&G are a promoters package with the tickets.

Which I wouldn't pay for, personally. I'm not singling Meat out, either- his are actually somewhat reasonable compared to what some artists charge, many of which don't even include the M&G. Often they include a bunch of what I consider worthless (or certainly not worth what you pay for it) merchandise. You want a front row seat for Bon Jovi? That will cost you $1500. Oh, but you get to keep your folding chair. :roll:

There are other means to thwart scalpers, if that's the aim. Springsteen does a lottery for the front row (the whole floor is general admission); scalpers can't sell a "front row seat", because there is no such thing. He's also done will-call only (with ID required) for the primo seats, and paperless tickets, which are non-transferable. Admitted, there are still ways around these measures (nothing is totally scalper-proof), but it slows the scalpers down.

Some artists have been known to do the M&G plus prime ticket package to benefit charity; now that, I might go for.

[suzieq]

Which I wouldn't pay for, personally. I'm not singling Meat out, either- his are actually somewhat reasonable compared to what some artists charge, many of which don't even include the M&G. Often they include a bunch of what I consider worthless (or certainly not worth what you pay for it) merchandise. You want a front row seat for Bon Jovi? That will cost you $1500. Oh, but you get to keep your folding chair. :roll:

There are other means to thwart scalpers, if that's the aim. Springsteen does a lottery for the front row (the whole floor is general admission); scalpers can't sell a "front row seat", because there is no such thing. He's also done will-call only (with ID required) for the primo seats, and paperless tickets, which are non-transferable. Admitted, there are still ways around these measures (nothing is totally scalper-proof), but it slows the scalpers down.

Some artists have been known to do the M&G plus prime ticket package to benefit charity; now that, I might go for.

I would and I have....because he's totally worth it.

Kudos to Bruce for an alternate way, but I like the way Meat has his promoters doing it (and they avoid the scalpers too), it's nice and organized and you get the M&G with the prime seats. My local casino show that Meat does....no M&G are ever available AND you can only ever get as close as 3rd row with a legal scalper. Venue holds the cards regarding front 2 rows. Still, I hold to my opinion that Meat doesn't do the M&G for the $.

[BostonAngel]

I just don't buy what you are selling here. Seriously, the man is a professional and when he meets his fans at a M&G he is genuinely engaged. If he's had a bad day with the venue or travel or traffic or his soup was cold, it's all checked at the door before he meets his fans. He's appreciative of them coming (sometimes thousands of miles) and he makes fans feel special, as well as, in the moment. I always found him relaxed and in a great mental place for socializing.


I am not trying to SELL anything, just expressing a thought. FACT is he is an actor and he can act. That is what I am selling. so you don't believe he is a good actor? OR you don't believe he can act?
And if you you had taken the time to read my post after Nixon's you would see that I clarifed what I said. You and I are actually saying the same thing. You are going to twist my words around for your own reasons, i get that.
As I said b4, I have the balls to stand by EVERYTHING I have said about Meat - both the positive & the negative. Up until this situation I had always been supportive of him and his work. I have admired him, said postive things about him, defended him when others have criticized him. I don't think anyway can dispute that too much.
I have been a fan of the man & his music since I was 14 years old. For once I disagree with him, since he is behaving badly. I have always spoken my mind. Anyone who truly knows me, knows that.
I have said that I am still a fan of his music and will always be. AT the moment I am disillusioned and a bit hurt by the man as a person, which I have also said b4. I am not alone in that feeling. If I were alone in that then this thread would be pointless, because there would be no DEBATE.

[suzieq]

I am not trying to SELL anything, just expressing a thought. FACT is he is an actor and he can act. That is what I am selling. so you don't believe he is a good actor? OR you don't believe he can act?

His ability to act has NOTHING to do with M&G interactions period. He's a professional. I can put on a smile going to work and I'M NO ACTRESS.

As a separate note, he's a damn good actor.

And if you you had taken the time to read my post after Nixon's you would see that I clarifed what I said. You and I are actually saying the same thing. You are going to twist my words around for your own reasons, i get that.

You are backpedaling NOT clarifying.

As I said b4, I have the balls to stand by EVERYTHING I have said about Meat - both the positive & the negative. Up until this situation I had always been supportive of him and his work. I have admired him, said postive things about him, defended him when others have criticized him. I don't think anyway can dispute that too much.
AT the moment I am disillusioned and a bit hurt by the man as a person, which I have also said b4.

Your disillusionment is your own fault. He picked a candidate, you ran amuck on his page, he responded multiple times in a respectful manner there and now you come here and start the whole thing up all over again and NOW you're the victim. Please stand by your words and be a martyr for them ...go ahead and claim you did nothing wrong, just stated your opinion right?.... good on you.

[BostonAngel]

His ability to act has NOTHING to do with M&G interactions period. He's a professional. I can put on a smile going to work and I'M NO ACTRESS.

As a separate note, he's a damn good actor.



You are backpedaling NOT clarifying.



Your disillusionment is your own fault. He picked a candidate, you ran amuck on his page, he responded multiple times in a respectful manner there and now you come here and start the whole thing up all over again and NOW you're the victim. Please stand by your words and be a martyr for them ...go ahead and claim you did nothing wrong, just stated your opinion right?.... good on you.

Yet again, you are trying to twist my words. I realized after I read Nixon's post, that my original post may have been misunderstood, which is why i did take the time to clarify what I was trying to say. I wasn't back pedaling, just clarifying
ONCE AGAIN, my beef was not with his endorsement of Romney. My beef was with his immature and generally bad behavior in dealing with the aftermath. the last straw for me was him insulting the majority of his fan base and me personally. I actuallly feel honored that he singled me out; it means that he was paying attention to what I was saying and i made him think.
I will have to remember that you feel that insulting others is perfectly acceptable & adult behavior.
I didn't run amuck, I stated my disappointment with his endorsement and my feelings on what I felt to be immature and objectionable behavior in the aftermath. Yes, OTHERS, did run amuck. He responded TWICE to one of my posts on FB; the first was with some respect, the 2nd wasn't.
If someone comes at me, I will stand up for myself.
Yes, it is MY FEELING that I am disillusioned. Again, I am not the only one that feels that way. And ONCE AGAIN, if there wasn't anyone else that felt that way then this thread called DEBATE would be pointless & wouldn't exist.
I am NOT starting it up all over again. People like you keep coming at me and I will repeat AGAIN, I DO STAND BY THEY THINGS I HAVE SAID. People like you just make me keep on repeating it.
I am neither a victim or a matyr and I never claimed to be. Even though I may have been harsh, I didn't do anything wrong. I did state MY OPINION. I say what I think and mean what I say.

[Evil Ernie]

:twisted: Please, please, tell me you're joking :facepalm:

In some peoples defence, the thread title isn't very clear.

I understand that you don't want to edit ML's post, but the opening post just gives the impression of chaos and a free for all.

I think that you should edit the thread title to be more clear.



Meat takes take out to post on this forum
He does not have to.



You know what? You're right.

Some people just aren't cut out for the internet.

[evil nickname]

Some people just aren't cut out for the internet.

Ding-dong. We have a winner.

[carole]

Lucy, money is irrelavant, people make their choice to do all those things or not. He knows we don't forget him, he's not daft.

Can't you see that this is all a culmination of many years and years of Meat bashing here on this site by the same old few, and finally Meat has snapped and decided to do something about it?

To be honest, whoever was offended by the 97% sentence (which was a fake number anyway as explained) probably deserves to be in it, because if you know you're a good fan, and a respectful person who shows consideration for Meats feelings when posting, then your instant reaction is, well he doesn't mean me so i'm not offended. That was my reaction and that's why I have no problem with Meat standing up for himself.

I never for one second considered myself to be among the 97%, so I wasn't offended either.

Carole

[Kathy]

I didn't read the "voice thread." I saw it start, and thought "ohhhh jeez." So I can't go down through and say, "Ok this post would hurt MY feelings, if it were about me," "This one would irritate me," or "THIS one would make me cry." I can imagine how it might feel, however, to have a group of people quite dispassionately discussing a part of me, a vital part of me with which I express myself artistically.

Discussing what you love most about how Meat expresses himself vocally is one thing, but criticising his voice itself is quite another. Someone asked why Meat didn't take the constructive criticism on board. We're not talking set lists or song arrangements or the Paradise skit here! I very frankly don't believe there is any such thing as "constructive criticism" of Meat's voice, unless your name happens to be Eric Vetro.

Meat is a nice guy; many of you know that. He doesn't become angry without reason. For him to post as angrily as he did, he must have been really hurting. Knowing that, I felt terrible when I read his first post, but at no point did I feel his anger was directed at me, so I took no offense.

Instead of taking offense where none was intended, those of us who do care about Meat as a person (as well as an artist) will continue to support him. My hope is that a few loyal fans who do feel offended now might reconsider, and upon realizing Meat has no reason to be angry with them, let it pass. Those on this board who don't care about Meat, or who feel no loyalty toward him, might question why they are here. "Just for the music" isn't good enough. The man himself is here, so this forum is as much about him as it is about his work.

-Kathy

.

[carole]

I just don't buy what you are selling here. Seriously, the man is a professional and when he meets his fans at a M&G he is genuinely engaged. If he's had a bad day with the venue or travel or traffic or his soup was cold, it's all checked at the door before he meets his fans. He's appreciative of them coming (sometimes thousands of miles) and he makes fans feel special, as well as, in the moment. I always found him relaxed and in a great mental place for socializing.


That's exactly right, when I went to some of the M & G's in the UK during the Casa De Carne tour, Meat was being hammered by some of the press over there, the weather was horrendous for some of the shows and Meat and the band had got lost on the way to one of the shows. But he was warm and gracious to all of us, and even made jokes about what the press were saying about him. He really was a trooper. :-)

Carole

[olblueeyes]

I never for one second considered myself to be among the 97%, so I wasn't offended either.

Carole

Neither did I and so neither was I. There seem to be a lot of peeps taking offence on behalf of others (a national pastime thesedays it seems).

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[lorenzoduke]

Neither did I and so neither was I. There seem to be a lot of peeps taking offence on behalf of others (a national pastime thesedays it seems).

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If someone tells 97% of a club or group I'm part of to go to hell, I'm not going to act like I couldn't care less, regardless of whether I feel like I'm personally counted amongst that number.

[Mr. Happy]

I didn't read the "voice thread." I saw it start, and thought "ohhhh jeez." So I can't go down through and say, "Ok this post would hurt MY feelings, if it were about me," "This one would irritate me," or "THIS one would make me cry." I can imagine how it might feel, however, to have a group of people quite dispassionately discussing a part of me, a vital part of me with which I express myself artistically.

None of the posts in the thread warranted the response it got. Not. One. The absolute WORST statement made in that thread was "Meat's current singing style does not appeal to me." That was the exact level of consideration it was delivered with, too. There was "dispassionate discussion." Most of it wasn't even centered around modern Meat. At the time it was closed, it was praising Welcome to the Neighborhood era Meat.

For those of you who never got around to reading that thread, it wasn't "let's put his voice under a microscope and tear it to shreds!" It was a discussion about the different periods of Meat's career and how his voice differed between them. Like how it became more raw starting around the early 2000s. There was no one criticising anything. It was just...discussion. Normally what you do on a DISCUSSION BOARD.

Discussing what you love most about how Meat expresses himself vocally is one thing, but criticising his voice itself is quite another.

Except this didn't happen.

Meat is a nice guy; many of you know that. He doesn't become angry without reason..instead of taking offense where none was intended...

Did you not read the first few posts of this thread? We were told we were evil, should go to hell, not buy any of his future work or attend any concerts. Oh, and we would be thrown out of the roof if we ever went to a Meet and Greet.

Good thing he's not planning to tour Australia again :roll:

The man himself is here, so this forum is as much about him as it is about his work.

This is fair enough. Thing is, I respect this. So do most, if not all, other people here. That doesn't change the fact that 97% of us are scum though, apparently.

I get the impression that Meat simply does not like people talking about him full stop, ignoring whether it is positive or negative. And that's also fair enough. What's NOT fair enough is that if you know you don't like that (and you're going to get it, when you have a career as prolific as Meat's) is going out of your way to actively find discussion and attack these people for being "enemies" (I'm sorry, but what the ~~~~), regardless of whether or not it was mean or not.

This is a fan forum. Everyone here is a fan of Meat Loaf. To say otherwise it's just stupid. Meat, if don't like people talking about Meat Loaf, then don't go out of your way read it and ruin the experience for everyone.

Sorry for singling you out, Kathy :oops: I've seen a few people going "Oh...I didn't read the thread, but the reaction must be justified anyway!" No, no it is not justified, and neither is you jumping to conclusions without reading the thread in question. I can understand being offended from the reaction to the politics thing. The abuse from that was plain unfair. This, though. Not so much :roll:

To be honest, whoever was offended by the 97% sentence (which was a fake number anyway as explained) probably deserves to be in it, because if you know you're a good fan, and a respectful person who shows consideration for Meats feelings when posting, then your instant reaction is, well he doesn't mean me so i'm not offended. That was my reaction and that's why I have no problem with Meat standing up for himself.

There is not. One. Single. Poster. On. This. Site. Not ONE that I can think of off the top of my head that deserves to be a part of this so called 97%. I think it's ridiculous to propose this at all when EVERYONE here is a fan, otherwise they wouldn't be here at all. Everyone is respectful of Meat here. They have to be, otherwise they'd never hear the end of it :roll:

[chairboys]

EVERYONE here is a fan, [I]otherwise they wouldn't be here at all.

Exactly, Mr. Happy. Although I'm beginning to wonder from what I've read if that statement is now out of date!

[JennaG]

Meat is a nice guy; many of you know that. He doesn't become angry without reason. For him to post as angrily as he did, he must have been really hurting. Knowing that, I felt terrible when I read his first post, but at no point did I feel his anger was directed at me, so I took no offense.

Instead of taking offense where none was intended, those of us who do care about Meat as a person (as well as an artist) will continue to support him.

I agree with this. When I read the comments, I looked at them from Meat's perspective and asked myself 'what has made him post those remarks' I could see that there was a lot of hurt underlying the comments. I don't know the exact reasons why he was so hurt but he's not the only person to have ever said something he doesn't mean in a state of emotion and I'm more than happy to show him a little bit of understanding.

If people are offended by the remarks, I'm not going to say they are in the wrong or try to change their minds because that's up to them. I didn't believe I was included the 97% that was mentioned so I personally did not take offence.

[olblueeyes]

If someone tells 97% of a club or group I'm part of to go to hell, I'm not going to act like I couldn't care less, regardless of whether I feel like I'm personally counted amongst that number.

Indeed, my point exactly - offence taken whether the statement is aimed at you or not.

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