I don't know much about all this, being in the UK! I do however really don't like Mitt Romney at all, and think he's wrong going forward for the USA - That my views. Obama all the way - He endorses gay marriage which is good.
We should all be equal, and I know not many folk agree with that. I personally don't care, we're all different - thats whats makes us, us! I'm gay, so Without a doubt I think Romney is a tit! My views -OBAMA ALL THE WAY!
Meat can vote for who he likes, as I and you all can. Fair enough!
I still love my ML, and as previous people have said, this will all blow over.

YAY Its SATURDAY NIGHT!!! Time to dress up (halloween):D

Could not agree more, and having met and spoken to some of the band members, I'd be extremely surprised if they shared Meat's views. Even if all but one or two of them did, making it a band performance would still be out of line in my opinion.

If you're performing at a rally for a political party, the implication is that you are for the party.

I understand your point that Republicans don't think they are homophobic regarding broader local and national issues. But I believe the institutionalized homophobia is a compelling example of the elitism of Republican policies that unabashedly show preference to those with inherent powers in American society: white, male, wealthy, at the expense of the minority: people of color, lgbt, women, immigrants, non-christians, poor. And each of their policies, whether it be taxation, foreign relations, environment, predictably favor white, male, corporate, wealthy, over those who are historically oppressed and marginalized. I'm saying I stand with gays, womens, physically disabled, immigrants, foreign born, and the 99%, against the policies that unfairly tilt the game in favor of the elite.

:twisted: Where were the band?
I didn't see them. All I saw were the four singers and Romney.

In the short performance they did before Meat spoke and before the final clip. Paul posted he was tickled to be on the Presidential candidates bus, so I doubt he was frogmarched against his will ;)

Caryl

It really baffles me the idea that Meat's endorsement would carry any clout at this point (other than in harming his own career, alienating large chunks of his fanbase, pissing off people who don't like celebrities telling them who to vote for etc.).

"Hey everyone - he's rich, quite old, Southern, white and male....and he's voting for Romney! Wow, just the kind of people we're short of!" :twisted: ;)

I'm curious - did they play the L'il Jon bit during Stand In The Storm?

I understand what you're saying Michael, but as I have said, I have never voted for a party or politician whose every policy I endorse. Sometimes it's the lesser of two weevils .. more often I choose depending on who/what I think is most likely to provide the answer to the most pressing issues. So before searching out Meat's page to accuse him of being a "homophobic fat ~~~~" I would like to find out if he DID support those particular views. Before, for eg, writing to David telling him he should abandon his RHPS screening and burn his albums, I would perhaps ask him if he thought Meat was anti-gay. If I were a fan who knew anything of Meat I would find it hard to believe he DID support that view .. and if I posted on his page would simply ask him how he reconciled this, because I had never seen anything to suggest he was anti-gay.

In the case of the former Griffith's central platform IS being racist. In the case of the latter I wouldn't assume he shared every policy and value of the Liberal party .. I have voted Liberal and I don't.

No, I have never seen anyone at a rally do this

Assumptions are dangerous. Making assumptions and screaming profanities and threats on the basis of them is wholly unjustified in my view. I abhor Nick Griffith's platform, but would NEVER post the vile and ignorantly angry rhetoric and threats on any web page he had.

Meat is a concerned, intelligent, well researched and thoughtful man. I doubt he failed to expect what transpired, and presumably considered it important enough to make a stand. As to his fans turning on him .. I have grave doubts that all those who have rushed to post abuse are all fans. In my view some are angry Obama supporters who have searched to find his page. Anyone can write that they are an angry fan .. most should know a little more about him than to jump to assumptions, and few of them have any references to Meat's music on their pages.

And nothing excuses profanity, threats, abuse in my view. That's not freedom of speech, it's abuse of it .. again in my view.

Caryl

Yup. They didn't have a screen up, so only the vocal tape was played. But when that part came up people were allowed on the stage with Romney signs.

Paul is in fact only one member of the band. There are 6 more people that make up the Neverland Express

Unless he had L'il Jon's personal permission to use his performance at that rally, I find that absolutely beyond the pale.

By the way, little trivia: Romney is still running an ad featuring, and refusing to condemn supporter & contributor Mourdock who said last week that a child born from rape is a 'gift from God'. Romney apparently still accepts endorsement from Mourdock. Meat Loaf endorses Romney to the point that he thinks we should argue with our own family and friends about why they should vote for him. Meat feels so strongly in favor of Romney, after all, that after 40 years of never endorsing a candidate, he feels this is the one.

I would be very, very interested to hear how Meat would 'argue' with a gay friend or a female friend on these matters. I doubt 'Oh, but I don't agree with him on that... but here's why you should vote for him' would go over too well. In fact if I tried to argue with a gay person about why they should vote for someone who considers their relationship 'less-than', I wouldn't expect them to be my friend for much longer.

It's a shame that Meat Loaf has chosen to embroil himself in all of this when as far as I can see, it has done no good for Romney or for himself. If you endorse someone to the degree that he has, this will happen. It's a shame when Meat was able to convey his views so eloquently on HIAH, alienating nobody in the process, that he felt the need to do this.

Personally I think it's the single worst move of his career, and using his fame to attempt to sway people's votes (albeit seemingly unsuccessfully) goes against much of what I have admired about him for most of my life.

I have never read or heard anything about Meat being anti-gay. I don't beleive he is. Last night on fb I tried to calm people down but there was so much mud slinging I couldn't keep up with it. :( I will say the endorsement might be a hard pill to swallow for many.

If you were friends with a gay couple and were going to a casual dinner with them last week, would you show up in a Meat Loaf shirt? Would you do now?

If you're an Obama supporter, if you were vacationing in Ohio, would you wear a Meat Loaf shirt out?

If you worked as a secretary at a woman's health clinic and they had a casual day, would you wear a Meat Loaf t-shirt?

He's made the name, the brand, stand for something his fans may very well not stand by, where previously it only stood for great music and a man who sings his heart out.

Some probably think that's completely ridiculous, and fair enough.

What I don't understand -and I wonder if Meat can explain himself on this- when you never ever before endorsed a candidate, but you do it now. Doesn't that mean you stand behind that candidate and his ideas for 100%? So why is Meat defending his thoughts being oposite to Romney's?

If there are fundamental differences in their believes, what value does the endorsement have?

He never ever, ever did this before, but now he felt it was needed to go ahead and endorse a candidate. To disagree with him the day after on Facebook. Don't pussy out and say "I suport this anti-gay candidate so much I endorse him' and then claim that you have done so much for gay people and you will always defend their rights. I find that weird, unbelievable and not very convincing...

I really don't care who he votes for or who will be the President of the US for the next term. But if you make a statement, that you never dared to take before, then you got to show that you have a backbone yourself and either come out and say I SUPORT ROMNEY FOR THE FULL 100% or take back your endorsement...

Yes to all, and I would assure them that Meat doesn't have a homophobic bone in his body

I know. Did I suggest there weren't? I merely pointed out there was ONE member who didn't seem to be there against his will. I make no assumptions abut the others .. nor speculation either way. They are adults.

I shall repeat what some have already said, I will always love Meat as an artist to the same extend that I will continue to enjoy Clint Eastwood films. The Romney thing however, scary. If he wins then I honestly feel sorry for america. It might sound stupid but I cant help but feel disappointed about meat endorsing a guy who in my view is so morally inept. :?

Meat HAS said why. He has said he really believes that Romney is best placed to deal with the economic issues the US is facing, and that although he voted for Obama he does not believe any more that he can do this.

Whether he chooses to post that here is up to him.

I get your point. And NO, I wouldn't take the chance on wearing a Meat shirt in those instances. As fans of his we know that he has said that he supports gay rights. The person who isn't a fan and heard he endorsed Romney may have the perception that Meat was anti-gay. Out of respect for them, I wouldn't wear it in order to avoid the controversy. In all honesty I also wouldn't do it because i couldn't fully defend Meat's position as being supportive of gays. He says it, however he says he fully supports Romney as President. Romney has said that he is not for gay rights. Now Meat is trying to back-pedal (in my opinion) on his position and say well no, I don't really support his view on this issue but I still want him to be President. Has my head spinning and saying WTF???? You either support the candidate or you stay out of the political fray if you can't support that candidate completely. You can't have it both ways. The thing is that most people won't' see what Meat posts on Facebook attempting to clarify his position which only has me even more baffled. All they hear is that Meat Loaf endorsed Mitt Romney as President and performed (badly) at an event with him. The perception is again, that he supports ALL of Romney's policies. Meat's words are saying one thing - not just on the gay issue, with other issues as well. - his action of publicly supporting Romney is saying another thing. In my mind actions speak louder than words.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who had this thought. And even if I am a rookie here, I dare to encourage you all to think about the really questionable part of Meat's behavior. Which in my opinion is not the endorsement itself, but the fact that he pulled the whole band along.

I was just on fb and there are tons of people "liking" just because of Romney. I knew it was going to happen but it's still a drag.

:wtf: Is that the big announcement people on this forum have been speculating about?

Meat Loaf can vote for and support whoever he likes - as long as he doesn't try to impose his political views on me. As for his appearance at that event: I'm sorry but it made me cringe. If he had at least delivered a good show... The skilled actor and experienced stage artist Meat Loaf appeared to be absent. Instead there was a strange speech and bad singing. In fact it sounded more like screaming to me and it even seemed as if he was trying to drown out everybody else during America The Beautiful. That's "endorsement"? The videos I saw appeared kind of bizarre to me, like some satire on politics and showbiz. :twisted:

In my opinion, there is one important thing missing (aside from convincing words and impressive vocals) - it's credibility. It's not that long ago that Meat Loaf claimed that he was "independent", appeared at the GLAAD Awards and said things like this:

(http://expressmilwaukee.com/article-...meat-loaf.html)

Now he's campaigning for that presidential candidate all of a sudden, go figure... :??::??::??:

I'm not in favor of artists publicly supporting politicians or telling you who to vote for but at least other artists have managed to take a firm stand most of the time - no matter if it's Springsteen or Nugent, "left" or "right". Compared to those people, Meat Loaf appears to be more like a swaying, erratically roaming ship of which you don't really know what its home port is and that's apparently steered by a captain who can't make up his mind. That's one of the reasons why I can't take his "political" statements seriously.

I'd never argue with friends and relatives and sacrifice my personal relationships to damn politics just because some "celebrity" tells me to. The Berlin Wall came down because people were sick and tired of being told what to think, what to say and what kind of "politics" to support. I'm sceptical of people who try to railroad their "political" beliefs in the way that Meat Loaf obviously encourages.

Politics is a dirty nasty controversial subject. If you can't stand the heat & the backlash from whatever position you choose, don't jump into the game! We all knew that all the Romney haters would be LIKING Meat's page. He had to know it would happen too as soon as he appeared on stage with Romney and made his endorsement public. I think it is unfortunate that he and whoever works on his FAcebook page seemed ill-prepared & even suprised by it. He is breaking one of the major rules of social media: DON"T FEED THE TROLLS!!! Feeding the trolls only makes them bigger & stronger. Responding to them and atempting to rationalize with them only makes them worse. Starve them by not responding, then they will weaken and go away.
It is a drag, however that is how social media works, even if you don't agree. Meat's own actions were what caused it - deal with it.

I was also speaking of the Romney fans. Instead of wall being about Meat and his music it's turning into his endorsement. I know it will blow over.

I think this is finely worded. Endorsements are dangerous especially when you are unfamiliar with the persons personal ideology. (We know what to expect from Springsteen for example)

Lets just put it this way, if I was a gay Meat Loaf fan- or if I was a women that was a victim of rape. Or if I fell into the 47% of Americans that Romney doesn't worry about no matter how he tries to spin in the other way when he is caught. If I was a fan that fell into these categories can you honestly say you wouldn't feel dissapointed and divided by Meats sudden public views, its stupid and ignorant that WILL turn people away. Meat should have left it alone, he might as well call his next tour the Tea Party tour because they might be the only folks that will go. It would be foolish to think that endorsements do not matter to people especially when you are a devoted fan.

I can't lie. I'm struggling right now.