Infraction System
 

The vbulletin forum software we're using has a new feature since the 3.6.0 update, which we will start to use as of now. Rather than just posting a warning, if some member violates our rules for any reason, we will now hand out these "infractions".

A vbulletin infraction consists of a certain point level and a certain duration. If you pass a certain threshold, some or all forum privileges will be revoked for the specified infraction duration.

We have defined the following infraction levels:

1. Old thread bump - 3 points, 10 days
2. Thread hijacking - 5 points, 10 days
3. Inappropriate language - 10 points, 10 days
4. Trolling (=intentionally starting an argument with another member) - 10 points, 15 days
5. Insulting other members, 15 points, 30 days
6. Inappropriate content (bootlegs, warez, ... etc.) - 15 points, 30 days
7. Insulting or threatening a staff member - 20 points, 60 days
8. Advertisments (Spam) - 100 points, permanent

Thresholds:

• 30 points - new thread privilege removed
• 60 points - new thread and PM privilege removed
• 70 points - 7 days ban
• 80 points - 2 week ban
• 90 points - 1 month ban
• 100 points - permanent ban
• 3 infractions - 1 day ban

As an example, if you post a link where you can download the new Vista operating system including keys (=warez), you'll get an infraction of 15 points that lasts for 30 days. If 20 days later you post another warez link you get another 15 point/30 day infraction giving you 30 points and the new thread privilege removed for 10 days (60 days for the second infraction, minus 20 days expired on the first). After another 10 days the privilege is restored, because the 15 points from the 1st infraction will have expired, leaving you with 30 points for the following 20 days.

A spam infraction worth 100 points will result in an instant permanent ban.

We're still tweaking the points and expiry times, but for now this is how it is setup.

Pardon my ignorance but what's old thread bumping?

Posting a reply in a thread that is a few years old. ;)

Ah ok! Thank you R...as always you are an education to me

Seems like a right load of bolloxs to me to try and create an impractical Utopian regime.

Has any of the gods, I mean mods :roll: asked Meat Loaf imself, sorry himself ;) what he thinks about it? Would be nice to know if he approves of such censorship, since it has been mentioned many times that his name is above the door.

Anyway TheNakedWire.com has a forum where NO stupid rules are in place.

How many points has that clocked me up so far? :mrgreen:

Pud :twisted:

I think that any forum/meeting where views are expressed has to have a basic set of ground rules/boundaries.

Saying that though, it is also important (and fair) that any sanctions have a right of appeal, that right of appeal should also be independant from the person issueing the sanction.

This is a test drive, if it doesn't work - we'll stop using it. The whole thingie is set up very relaxed, so you have to work really hard to earn some points. :p

And you're on zero points, you should be able to see this in your profile.

After good behaviour will you lose points if you gain any?

They expire automatically, except the spam infraction.

so, clearly spoken, that means posting bootlegs will result in a ban. right? A little too harsh, IMO, think of newbies.

but a right of appeal could solve that RJ

No, read my post again. Posting bootlegs 3 times within 30 days is worth a months ban.

right, was speaking of advertisements......definitely too late here

:twisted: Well if you look at the infraction system, you'll see that there is very little new in the way of rules.

It's more in place as a aid to moderation, and letting mods have a more textbook approach when it comes to handing out warnings when appropiate.


Nice try :p

neil is this what u got me to try and test the day i got to abuse u.....??and it had never been uploaded....lol

:twisted: It is indeed.

We did have the infraction system at the time, we just hadn't configured it, so I asked you to abuse me for no reason :oops:

Actually, it usually costs me £200 an hour for that kind of treatment :roll:



Did I just say that out loud? :shock:

:lmao::lmao:

Perhaps the forum members should come up with an Infraction System for the mods, or at least a point system for rating their performance and if they're not up to scratch then they get banned from being a mod for a period of time.

Just a suggestion.

Pud :twisted:

Oh I'm sorry, but this room is for arguments ... you want room 12, just along the corridor.

Dave :twisted:

:lmao:

Pud :twisted:

I accept all the rules and promise to behave in a ummm...more acceptable manner...scout's honor!!!

Can I ask, if I may, 5.Insulting other members, 15 points, 30 days

7.Insulting or threatening a staff member - 20 points, 60 days.

Why is there a difference here? Are we all not the same? To me. I will abide by this and will follow the rules. It isn't right to insult anyone. But isn't it only fair that you should get the same amount of time, whoever the abuse is aimed at. 20 Points, 60 days for everyone.

R. You say it will show up on your profile, does that mean others will see it too or is it strictly for your eyes only just out of curiosity?

Nah...I looked at your profile...none are showing...so I think it's for your eyes only...

COOL! I have an infraction!:D

I wonder what that was for..........Hmmmmmmmm.......

For not polishing your jackboots probably :mrgreen:

Pud :twisted:

So let me get this straight... If I decide that I want to add something to a previous (old) thread, I'd be accused of 'bumping', so therefore it would be better for me to START A NEW THREAD, only for the mods to say "A thread on this topic already exists" and the merge them ?!?!:? :shock: :roll:

I don't get it...

Oh, you pratt, you beat me to it.

:D

On a side note: are we allowed to raffle off/list on Ebay, our points? :D

:twisted: I believe this is basically because staff members are more likely to recieve abuse than the average member.
The whole reason for having mods is to have them interject when people go too far.
As some people don't like it when you tell them they're in the wrong, you can get a flak load of abuse for the most routine matter.

One day I intend to write a book blowing the lid on what a mod has to deal with.

One catch - they'll have to sell it in the fiction department, because no ****** will believe it :shock:


YOU will see infraction points on your OWN profile.
Nobody else will see your infraction points except for the staff members.

Check your PM's.

If an infraction is issued you will automatically receive a PM from the staff member who issued it explaining why it was given.

This I believe is down to common sence.

If there is a thread "How did you become a fan", then obviously you have something new and relevant to add to the thread.

Likewise, in Trye Tracks & Broken Hearts, an opinion on a song from a new member is welcomed as it is something new

Couple of examples of "bad bumping"...........


A 4 yr old thread containing a review is bumped for...........

A 2 yr old thread asking the release date on a movie is bumped for......


A 5 yr old thread asking (and answering) "what did Meat eat for breakfast on 20/08/83? is bumped for...........



You get the picture on this.

If it is a thread where you have something new and relevant to add, I can't see it being a problem.

If you browse old threads, and bring the thread back from the dead just to say "Great review" "Thanks for the info" or (god forbid) "CHSIB" THAT is when it is unwanted bumping, as is answering questions posted years ago (even if they went unanswered).

This is not about having a stalinist regime here, despite what some of you may think. The system set up is an aid to making the running of this site quicker and easier for those involved, and also more consistent for the forum users. Common sense will prevail at the end of the day and with any luck the system will be rarely used anyway ... unless people continue to constantly and deliberately provoke things.

Please bear in mind we are governed by the laws of the country in which this site is hosted, which are more than likely different to the laws you are used to, as such there are some issues with this site and it's content that aren't experienced elsewhere.

:up: Thank's for clearing that up.
I don't have one I was just curious.

What counts as thread hijacking? I don't do staying on topic to well :twisted: and what one mod may see as ok another may not.

Deb

Hope fully Deb with this system we can level up any inconsistencies with the way that we mods act too ... as for staying on topic/thread hijacking I'm as guilty as you for not being able to do that too well, again it's a common sense thing really ...

:shock: Could be interesting...

There are no new rules, let alone new mods, except the thread hijacking and bumping. Relax.

Ok, we will consider this.

No, only staff and you can see your infractions

This is done for two reasons. First is the load on the database server. Each post with a certain age is stored twice in our database. One copy is completely parsed and rendered into html, the other one is just regular, with vbcodes, exactly like you posted it. This is done for performance reasons, because displaying a pre-parsed thread is way faster than parsing and displaying a thread. So, if you bump an old thread, first thing that happens is pre-parsing of that thread. And if you bump a large thread (> 1000 replies), it puts a significant load on the db server and thus slowing down the whole website. Secondly, bumping a thread which is a few years old, might just irritate people so that they draw wrong conclusions. On the other hand, you'll have to bump 10 old threads to pass the 1st limit, so relax. If a thread has been resting for more than a year, consider starting a new one. And if we merge it, then so be it, no problem.

Check PM for your infraction. :p
And yes, you may sell them there, but you are not allowed to link to that auction. :p

Well, if you would have posted something like "This thread is now about sharks." and have added a ton of your personal shark pictures here, then this would qualify as a thread hijack. Example thread.

Oh goody! Thank you R! :D

Start scouring Ebay, guys. :-P

I still think it's a load of bolloxs (Oooops 10 points) and is put in place not to aid the forum at all, but to give the gods, sorry mods (Oooops 20 points) a false sense of power and something to do.

I know I'm speaking for quite a few people when I say that perhaps the admin (R.) should sort out his mods first before incurring penalties on the members. Because lets be honest about it, some of them are f*cking sh!t and don't deserve to be a mod at all.

I have no idea how many points that lot is worth, I'm sure I'll get a PM telling me though :roll:

Pud :twisted:

Incidentally, what's a death threat to a non-mod member worth? :D

so we still can't say f*ck sh1t or c*nt!? ;) :-P

I could as well say that your post is the same load of bollocks, because nothing has changed. The penalties have been there before and the moderation powers didn't change. The only thing that's gone, is the randomness.

Regarding your comment regarding our choice of mods, feel free to PM me with your concerns, but try to forget about your personal issues with them first.

I hope you've given yourself 10 points for swearing :mrgreen:

I know you're gonna object, but I might as well say it anyway, could we have a public poll on the mods, who's the better ones and who isn't?. And the bottom two get booted, and if necessary replacements made. You could call it Survivor: Mods Island

Pud :twisted:

Would it suprise you that the software doesn't allow that? Guess it's by design. Bribe Chris, he probably can award me some points. :bleh:


As you already said, I can't do that.

I think i'd best just be a bit quieter then lol as I just read that thread and saw it more as a natural progression of convo rather than thread hijacking

Deb

PS Don't be giving me points for going OT now please, but glad to see the Avator back ;-)

There are worse examples, I was just too lazy to do a thorough search. :bleh:
Again, you'd need to derail 10 threads in a row and get points for all of them to even notice the influence ot the inraction system.

I'll take that as a compliment. :p :))

So does the software pick up that you swear / go OT / Hijack a thread etc ? I'm confused :?

Ah but is that a pic of you or the other one ;) :cool: hehe

No it's not automatic ...

No way, the mods decide about that.

So basically, nothing has changed whatsoever, it's just the mods have guidelines of demerit points for offences, rather than threatening/issuing bans immeditely, yes?

That sums it up pretty well.

Yes, more consistency that's all it gives.

I never said you can't do it, I said I know you're gonna object. As Admin, you can pretty much do whatever you want.

I think it's only fair that if the members are to be kept in line, then the mods should also, otherwise it will be seen as Stalinist, which is something AndyK clearly said it wasn't.

Pud :twisted:

I'd like to hijack the thread by adding the philosophical point that consistency is subjective. :-P

Neil explained to me earlier but thanks for explaining it again R. :up:.

I'm hijacking it further by turning it into a surrealist ramble about the inflections of time versus super-fluidity in the modern waxworks factory.

Translated into "bees don't enjoy the heat".

I have a question. What constitutes an insult? Is it a direct personal attack, a judgement call by a mod or can a member just be insulted by a post?

Jules :cool:

It is the same as before, either a ouright personal insult along the lines of "your opinion sucks becuse you are a total and utter ******* " or someone uses the report thread link to complain that they feel personally insulted by post because....

That actually sucks horses balls. Because if someone gives a personal opinion about something but it wasn't insultive to anyone personally, then they could get reported. I know this happens from personal experience.

There's probably a couple of points you can notch up on my tally there ;)

Pud :twisted:

So Pud, how many points do you have now lol :twisted:

I have no idea where they're displayed. I thought I had a Total of 130, but then realised that I was looking at the amount of Total PM's I have :lmao:

Off to clear my in and out boxes :D

Pud :twisted:

If you click on your username to view your profile, it will tell you how many points you've got, if any.

If we get any do we get told first or do they just appear?

Well I can't see anything, so I'm assuming I don't have any :mrgreen: Rock and ROLL the system has been Pudified :lmao:

Pud :twisted:

IIf points are given, a PM is always sent explaining why and how many.

So if you don't have any it doesn't say anything at all? Or does it say somewhere Number of points = 0 ?

Correct, it says nothing.

correct

I have to agree with you Pud, as a reporting of a post is totally subjective. I might be really extra sensitive and report everything which I assume to be a dig at me or I might be someone who actually doesn't give a monkeys and the same digs insults would go unreported unless another member reports it. So to use reports as a way is distinguishing whether someone has broken the rules isn't right in my opinion anyway. Plus someone might have it in for another member and just report all of their posts that could be viewed as a dig...

I actually see it a lot that people dig at others or say something and someone else will say the same thing back and they'll report it straight away, I know life isn't fair but you can make it a little fairer by not letting the fact someone has reported a post sway your descision.

It doesn't Lou, it may raise something to the front of the queue to be looked at and have it logged, but in no way does it sway a decision. All posts are read by a good proportion of the team on here.

Good I'm glad. I don't have a problem with the infraction system just the way it may be inplemented...

Does it mean there will be less locked threads?

What guarantees are there that no posts are going to be misinterpetted by the 'team' due to say certain prejudices they may have towards a member?

Also, because the board is made up of people from many different countries that use many different forms of slang, what's to say that an innocent post is posted or interpretted the wrong way?

Pud :twisted:

Exactly the same guarantee's Pud that there are that certain posts by certain members that may be misinterpreted by other members of this board because of their prejudices towards that member, at the end of the day we're all human. Some more so than others I'll admit :))


Which is why the team is multi-national too, with people from the Uk, Germany, Holland and Yorkshire.

At the end of the day the onl thing that has changed is the introduction of a system that will provide more consistency, not less as you seem to be implying.

The introduction of the system means that people could incur points that may ultimately lead them to being banned, surely asking for clarification on the fairness of judgement before giving someone points isn't too much to ask.

I know the mods don't like their authority to be questioned or ego's dented, but that's not what I'm doing. I just want assurances that a system that's being implemented is going to be honest and fair for all and not Stalinist.

Pud :twisted:

Following a few PM queries regarding this, can i reassure people that if you are not a member who recieves regular bans/cautions you will not be affected in any way.

The introduction of the system just means that whichever mod is dealing with a complaint will treat it in the same wqay and issue the same penalty if needed.

And yes, if we are unsure how to treat a member due to possible prejudice towards them, we will ask the rest of the team as we do already.

Thanks. All I wanted was reassurances for things to be fair. As there's only R. and about 5 mods that actively do something on a regular basis, I have question marks surrounding the others and their ability to fairly give out points.

Pud :twisted:

Oh great. :roll: See you all in about 10 years. :shock:

Unless I can trade my points for cash? :-P

Infractions can be reversed or even deleted, so if an infraction you received seems to be unfair, let us know.

:twisted: And be sure to have your crdit card details to hand :mrgreen:

Now, now... who mentioned unfair. ;)

"and what do points make?? PRIZES"

Yeah the first one to 70 points gets a week ban...

thats a terrible prize.

How many points does it take to win a goldfish?

I thought them animal rights activist, tree hugging hippie type b'stards banned people from winning goldfish :shock:

Pud :twisted:

Oh alright, a fluffy teddy then.

Or does the Royal Society for the Protection of Stuffed Toys object to that?

http://www.mlukfc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8849

The posting of infraction points, the reason they were (apparently) given and who gave them is NOT in breach of the PM privacy policy at all, as the points are displayed in the User CP section, and therefor must be outside of the Infraction System ruling of no PM's to be posted.

Can we have some clarification please?

Pud :twisted:

OK.

As R. said earlier, the infraction system itse;f doesn't actually provide any rules at all, it's merely a method of enforcing them if the need arises.

With respect to your specifc question Pud. Whilst it may not technically be a breach of the PM policy, it is still bad form (along with being in breach of the forum rules) is it not to publicly post a discussion about moderation decisions? End of the day there can't be an individual infraction for every possible break of the rules, so the best fit was used I guess.

Infraction points are only visible to the moderation team and the member who has incurred them.

Anyone else curious about anything? Or can I go back to installing this router and all the guff that's come with it?

Erm, yes.

I'm curious about the goldfish: are they standard yellow/orange, or are there a variety of shades? And, should enough points be won, is there an upgrade to Koi option?

:lol:

:roll:

Here´s an idea:
how about an anti-infraction system, where you can earn positive things with senseful posts or helping other users? So that could compensate the negative points. And on the other hand people would have a reason for good behaviour and politeness.

eh?